Planeswalker Infinite Ultimate Combo

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Infinite combos in Magic are awesome (if you're a Johnny). Planeswalker ultimate abilities are awesome (if you're a Timmy). Combining the two would be even more awesome. Then you could have a billion emblems from Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, or Kiora, the Crashing Wave. Because dealing a billion damage isn't as cool as doing it every time you cast a spell. And getting a billion krakens isn't as cool as getting them every turn.



What's the fewest number of cards (besides the planeswalker) that allows you to activate a planeswalker's ultimate ability an arbitrary number of times?










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    Infinite combos in Magic are awesome (if you're a Johnny). Planeswalker ultimate abilities are awesome (if you're a Timmy). Combining the two would be even more awesome. Then you could have a billion emblems from Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, or Kiora, the Crashing Wave. Because dealing a billion damage isn't as cool as doing it every time you cast a spell. And getting a billion krakens isn't as cool as getting them every turn.



    What's the fewest number of cards (besides the planeswalker) that allows you to activate a planeswalker's ultimate ability an arbitrary number of times?










    share|improve this question























      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite











      Infinite combos in Magic are awesome (if you're a Johnny). Planeswalker ultimate abilities are awesome (if you're a Timmy). Combining the two would be even more awesome. Then you could have a billion emblems from Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, or Kiora, the Crashing Wave. Because dealing a billion damage isn't as cool as doing it every time you cast a spell. And getting a billion krakens isn't as cool as getting them every turn.



      What's the fewest number of cards (besides the planeswalker) that allows you to activate a planeswalker's ultimate ability an arbitrary number of times?










      share|improve this question













      Infinite combos in Magic are awesome (if you're a Johnny). Planeswalker ultimate abilities are awesome (if you're a Timmy). Combining the two would be even more awesome. Then you could have a billion emblems from Chandra, Torch of Defiance, Teferi, Hero of Dominaria, or Kiora, the Crashing Wave. Because dealing a billion damage isn't as cool as doing it every time you cast a spell. And getting a billion krakens isn't as cool as getting them every turn.



      What's the fewest number of cards (besides the planeswalker) that allows you to activate a planeswalker's ultimate ability an arbitrary number of times?







      magic-the-gathering






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      asked 3 hours ago









      Zags

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          2 Answers
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          up vote
          3
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          3 cards, in addition to the walker(s) you want to be hitting the ultimate of:



          • Tezzeret the Seeker

          • The Chain Veil

          • Everflowing Chalice

          Chalice needs at least 4 counters, to pay for the veil, tezzeret +1 untaps both chalice and veil allowing infinite uses of veil which resets both tezzeret and the other walker(s), letting you rebuild the + abilities on those walkers until they ultimate again and again.






          share|improve this answer




















          • Plus lands to pay for them.
            – Acccumulation
            2 hours ago










          • @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
            – Zags
            1 hour ago










          • So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
            – DarkCygnus
            33 mins ago

















          up vote
          1
          down vote













          The simplest combo in general is 3 cards: Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers.




          Explanation



          There are 3 card combos around the The Chain Veil (all you need to add is infinite mana and artifact untapping, such Astral Cornucopia with 4 counters and Filigree Sages, or the combo suggested by @Andrew). However, these combos only work for planeswalkers with a "+x" ability that won't kill either you or your opponent in the process of using them repeatedly, so it's incompatible with planeswalkers like Chandra, Bold Pyromancer, Sarkhan the Mad, and Jace Beleren.



          Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and a Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers. Gilder Bairn creates infinite mana with Gemstone Array (provided you have a way to tap the Bairn) and can also pump a planeswalker to have enough counters to use its ultimate the turn it enters the battlefield. Banishing Knack provides both a way to tap the Bairn and a way to bounce and replay the planeswalker, which causes it to be a new object and thus resets the count on how many times it has used a loyalty ability this turn. In order for this to work, you need sufficient starting counters on the Gemstone Array and some cheap permanent you can cast repeatedly to bounce with the Bairn while building up infinite mana on the Gemstone Array, noting that the planeswalker you plan to play can be this permanent. The number of starting counters you need on the array to combo off is 7 + [the cost of your cheapest non-land permanent].




          Special Cases



          There are fewer-card combos with particular planeswalkers, the clear winner of which is 1 card plus the planeswalker: Doubling Season with Jace, Cunning Castaway.



          You can also do this in Commander with 2 cards if Teferi, Temporal Archmage is your commander. All you need is The Chain Veil and Gilded Lotus on the battlefield (as well as 2 lands) and Teferi in the command zone. This works because The Chain Veil activations apply to later instances of Teferi that will be cast, so by repeatedly killing him via his "-1" ability to untap The Chain Veil and your mana sources, and replaying him from the command zone, you are gaining more mana than you are spending on the extra commander tax. As an added bonus, you get to draw your deck while doing this.






          share|improve this answer






















          • Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
            – Benjamin Cosman
            3 hours ago










          • Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
            – DenisS
            3 hours ago











          • @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
            – Zags
            2 hours ago










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          2 Answers
          2






          active

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          2 Answers
          2






          active

          oldest

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          oldest

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          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          3
          down vote













          3 cards, in addition to the walker(s) you want to be hitting the ultimate of:



          • Tezzeret the Seeker

          • The Chain Veil

          • Everflowing Chalice

          Chalice needs at least 4 counters, to pay for the veil, tezzeret +1 untaps both chalice and veil allowing infinite uses of veil which resets both tezzeret and the other walker(s), letting you rebuild the + abilities on those walkers until they ultimate again and again.






          share|improve this answer




















          • Plus lands to pay for them.
            – Acccumulation
            2 hours ago










          • @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
            – Zags
            1 hour ago










          • So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
            – DarkCygnus
            33 mins ago














          up vote
          3
          down vote













          3 cards, in addition to the walker(s) you want to be hitting the ultimate of:



          • Tezzeret the Seeker

          • The Chain Veil

          • Everflowing Chalice

          Chalice needs at least 4 counters, to pay for the veil, tezzeret +1 untaps both chalice and veil allowing infinite uses of veil which resets both tezzeret and the other walker(s), letting you rebuild the + abilities on those walkers until they ultimate again and again.






          share|improve this answer




















          • Plus lands to pay for them.
            – Acccumulation
            2 hours ago










          • @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
            – Zags
            1 hour ago










          • So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
            – DarkCygnus
            33 mins ago












          up vote
          3
          down vote










          up vote
          3
          down vote









          3 cards, in addition to the walker(s) you want to be hitting the ultimate of:



          • Tezzeret the Seeker

          • The Chain Veil

          • Everflowing Chalice

          Chalice needs at least 4 counters, to pay for the veil, tezzeret +1 untaps both chalice and veil allowing infinite uses of veil which resets both tezzeret and the other walker(s), letting you rebuild the + abilities on those walkers until they ultimate again and again.






          share|improve this answer












          3 cards, in addition to the walker(s) you want to be hitting the ultimate of:



          • Tezzeret the Seeker

          • The Chain Veil

          • Everflowing Chalice

          Chalice needs at least 4 counters, to pay for the veil, tezzeret +1 untaps both chalice and veil allowing infinite uses of veil which resets both tezzeret and the other walker(s), letting you rebuild the + abilities on those walkers until they ultimate again and again.







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 3 hours ago









          Andrew

          3,414327




          3,414327











          • Plus lands to pay for them.
            – Acccumulation
            2 hours ago










          • @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
            – Zags
            1 hour ago










          • So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
            – DarkCygnus
            33 mins ago
















          • Plus lands to pay for them.
            – Acccumulation
            2 hours ago










          • @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
            – Zags
            1 hour ago










          • So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
            – DarkCygnus
            33 mins ago















          Plus lands to pay for them.
          – Acccumulation
          2 hours ago




          Plus lands to pay for them.
          – Acccumulation
          2 hours ago












          @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
          – Zags
          1 hour ago




          @Andrew Good answer. Only works on planeswalkers with a +1 that doesn't kill your or your opponent though.
          – Zags
          1 hour ago












          So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
          – DarkCygnus
          33 mins ago




          So, basically, those cards plust 8 mana are needed (8 mana for the 4 kicks of 2 each). With the 8 mana play chalice, use Tezzeret +1 untap chalice, produce 4 mana with chalice to pay for veil, use +1 to untap both, repeat
          – DarkCygnus
          33 mins ago










          up vote
          1
          down vote













          The simplest combo in general is 3 cards: Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers.




          Explanation



          There are 3 card combos around the The Chain Veil (all you need to add is infinite mana and artifact untapping, such Astral Cornucopia with 4 counters and Filigree Sages, or the combo suggested by @Andrew). However, these combos only work for planeswalkers with a "+x" ability that won't kill either you or your opponent in the process of using them repeatedly, so it's incompatible with planeswalkers like Chandra, Bold Pyromancer, Sarkhan the Mad, and Jace Beleren.



          Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and a Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers. Gilder Bairn creates infinite mana with Gemstone Array (provided you have a way to tap the Bairn) and can also pump a planeswalker to have enough counters to use its ultimate the turn it enters the battlefield. Banishing Knack provides both a way to tap the Bairn and a way to bounce and replay the planeswalker, which causes it to be a new object and thus resets the count on how many times it has used a loyalty ability this turn. In order for this to work, you need sufficient starting counters on the Gemstone Array and some cheap permanent you can cast repeatedly to bounce with the Bairn while building up infinite mana on the Gemstone Array, noting that the planeswalker you plan to play can be this permanent. The number of starting counters you need on the array to combo off is 7 + [the cost of your cheapest non-land permanent].




          Special Cases



          There are fewer-card combos with particular planeswalkers, the clear winner of which is 1 card plus the planeswalker: Doubling Season with Jace, Cunning Castaway.



          You can also do this in Commander with 2 cards if Teferi, Temporal Archmage is your commander. All you need is The Chain Veil and Gilded Lotus on the battlefield (as well as 2 lands) and Teferi in the command zone. This works because The Chain Veil activations apply to later instances of Teferi that will be cast, so by repeatedly killing him via his "-1" ability to untap The Chain Veil and your mana sources, and replaying him from the command zone, you are gaining more mana than you are spending on the extra commander tax. As an added bonus, you get to draw your deck while doing this.






          share|improve this answer






















          • Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
            – Benjamin Cosman
            3 hours ago










          • Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
            – DenisS
            3 hours ago











          • @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
            – Zags
            2 hours ago














          up vote
          1
          down vote













          The simplest combo in general is 3 cards: Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers.




          Explanation



          There are 3 card combos around the The Chain Veil (all you need to add is infinite mana and artifact untapping, such Astral Cornucopia with 4 counters and Filigree Sages, or the combo suggested by @Andrew). However, these combos only work for planeswalkers with a "+x" ability that won't kill either you or your opponent in the process of using them repeatedly, so it's incompatible with planeswalkers like Chandra, Bold Pyromancer, Sarkhan the Mad, and Jace Beleren.



          Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and a Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers. Gilder Bairn creates infinite mana with Gemstone Array (provided you have a way to tap the Bairn) and can also pump a planeswalker to have enough counters to use its ultimate the turn it enters the battlefield. Banishing Knack provides both a way to tap the Bairn and a way to bounce and replay the planeswalker, which causes it to be a new object and thus resets the count on how many times it has used a loyalty ability this turn. In order for this to work, you need sufficient starting counters on the Gemstone Array and some cheap permanent you can cast repeatedly to bounce with the Bairn while building up infinite mana on the Gemstone Array, noting that the planeswalker you plan to play can be this permanent. The number of starting counters you need on the array to combo off is 7 + [the cost of your cheapest non-land permanent].




          Special Cases



          There are fewer-card combos with particular planeswalkers, the clear winner of which is 1 card plus the planeswalker: Doubling Season with Jace, Cunning Castaway.



          You can also do this in Commander with 2 cards if Teferi, Temporal Archmage is your commander. All you need is The Chain Veil and Gilded Lotus on the battlefield (as well as 2 lands) and Teferi in the command zone. This works because The Chain Veil activations apply to later instances of Teferi that will be cast, so by repeatedly killing him via his "-1" ability to untap The Chain Veil and your mana sources, and replaying him from the command zone, you are gaining more mana than you are spending on the extra commander tax. As an added bonus, you get to draw your deck while doing this.






          share|improve this answer






















          • Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
            – Benjamin Cosman
            3 hours ago










          • Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
            – DenisS
            3 hours ago











          • @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
            – Zags
            2 hours ago












          up vote
          1
          down vote










          up vote
          1
          down vote









          The simplest combo in general is 3 cards: Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers.




          Explanation



          There are 3 card combos around the The Chain Veil (all you need to add is infinite mana and artifact untapping, such Astral Cornucopia with 4 counters and Filigree Sages, or the combo suggested by @Andrew). However, these combos only work for planeswalkers with a "+x" ability that won't kill either you or your opponent in the process of using them repeatedly, so it's incompatible with planeswalkers like Chandra, Bold Pyromancer, Sarkhan the Mad, and Jace Beleren.



          Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and a Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers. Gilder Bairn creates infinite mana with Gemstone Array (provided you have a way to tap the Bairn) and can also pump a planeswalker to have enough counters to use its ultimate the turn it enters the battlefield. Banishing Knack provides both a way to tap the Bairn and a way to bounce and replay the planeswalker, which causes it to be a new object and thus resets the count on how many times it has used a loyalty ability this turn. In order for this to work, you need sufficient starting counters on the Gemstone Array and some cheap permanent you can cast repeatedly to bounce with the Bairn while building up infinite mana on the Gemstone Array, noting that the planeswalker you plan to play can be this permanent. The number of starting counters you need on the array to combo off is 7 + [the cost of your cheapest non-land permanent].




          Special Cases



          There are fewer-card combos with particular planeswalkers, the clear winner of which is 1 card plus the planeswalker: Doubling Season with Jace, Cunning Castaway.



          You can also do this in Commander with 2 cards if Teferi, Temporal Archmage is your commander. All you need is The Chain Veil and Gilded Lotus on the battlefield (as well as 2 lands) and Teferi in the command zone. This works because The Chain Veil activations apply to later instances of Teferi that will be cast, so by repeatedly killing him via his "-1" ability to untap The Chain Veil and your mana sources, and replaying him from the command zone, you are gaining more mana than you are spending on the extra commander tax. As an added bonus, you get to draw your deck while doing this.






          share|improve this answer














          The simplest combo in general is 3 cards: Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers.




          Explanation



          There are 3 card combos around the The Chain Veil (all you need to add is infinite mana and artifact untapping, such Astral Cornucopia with 4 counters and Filigree Sages, or the combo suggested by @Andrew). However, these combos only work for planeswalkers with a "+x" ability that won't kill either you or your opponent in the process of using them repeatedly, so it's incompatible with planeswalkers like Chandra, Bold Pyromancer, Sarkhan the Mad, and Jace Beleren.



          Gilder Bairn, Banishing Knack, and a Gemstone Array works for all planeswalkers. Gilder Bairn creates infinite mana with Gemstone Array (provided you have a way to tap the Bairn) and can also pump a planeswalker to have enough counters to use its ultimate the turn it enters the battlefield. Banishing Knack provides both a way to tap the Bairn and a way to bounce and replay the planeswalker, which causes it to be a new object and thus resets the count on how many times it has used a loyalty ability this turn. In order for this to work, you need sufficient starting counters on the Gemstone Array and some cheap permanent you can cast repeatedly to bounce with the Bairn while building up infinite mana on the Gemstone Array, noting that the planeswalker you plan to play can be this permanent. The number of starting counters you need on the array to combo off is 7 + [the cost of your cheapest non-land permanent].




          Special Cases



          There are fewer-card combos with particular planeswalkers, the clear winner of which is 1 card plus the planeswalker: Doubling Season with Jace, Cunning Castaway.



          You can also do this in Commander with 2 cards if Teferi, Temporal Archmage is your commander. All you need is The Chain Veil and Gilded Lotus on the battlefield (as well as 2 lands) and Teferi in the command zone. This works because The Chain Veil activations apply to later instances of Teferi that will be cast, so by repeatedly killing him via his "-1" ability to untap The Chain Veil and your mana sources, and replaying him from the command zone, you are gaining more mana than you are spending on the extra commander tax. As an added bonus, you get to draw your deck while doing this.







          share|improve this answer














          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer








          edited 40 mins ago

























          answered 3 hours ago









          Zags

          4,05221350




          4,05221350











          • Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
            – Benjamin Cosman
            3 hours ago










          • Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
            – DenisS
            3 hours ago











          • @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
            – Zags
            2 hours ago
















          • Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
            – Benjamin Cosman
            3 hours ago










          • Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
            – DenisS
            3 hours ago











          • @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
            – Zags
            2 hours ago















          Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
          – Benjamin Cosman
          3 hours ago




          Note that Voltaic Construct only untaps artifact creatures
          – Benjamin Cosman
          3 hours ago












          Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
          – DenisS
          3 hours ago





          Voltaic Construct + Gilded Lotus isn't an infinite mana combo, and Voltaic Construct can't untap Chain Veil anyway.
          – DenisS
          3 hours ago













          @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
          – Zags
          2 hours ago




          @BenjaminCosman Whoops; I misremebered the ability. This has been removed
          – Zags
          2 hours ago

















           

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