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Why is 5…Be7 played before …b5 in the main line of the Closed Ruy Lopez?
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Here is what I've seen described as the main line of the Closed Ruy Lopez up to move 7:
[fen ""]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6
5. O-O Be7 (5... b5 6. Bb3 Be7 7. Re1 d6) 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6
I'm interested in Black's fifth move in particular. The top three options, with number of games according to the lichess opening book, are
- Be7 (43,520). Described in books as going to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
- b5 (8,126). Described as going to the Arkhangelsk variation.
- Nxe4 (4,844). Open Ruy Lopez.
Now 5...Be7 is clearly the most popular choice, but after 5... b5 6. Bb3, Black could choose to transpose to the Closed Ruy Lopez with 6... Be7 (shown as a variant in the diagram above). Here are the frequencies after 6. Bb3:
- Bb7 (3,452). Arkhangelsk variation.
- Bc5 (2,827). Neo-Arkhangelsk variation.
- Be7 (1,765). Transposing back to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
My question is why is 5...Be7 overwhelmingly more popular than 5...b5? Assuming Black wants to get into the Closed Ruy Lopez, what would they lose by playing 5...b5? An argument for the latter is that by playing 5...b5, Black doesn't need to worry about the Delayed Exchange variation.
Judging by the book, the transposition is doable and some people do play it, but they are a small minority (less than 5%).
opening ruy-lopez transpositions
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
Here is what I've seen described as the main line of the Closed Ruy Lopez up to move 7:
[fen ""]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6
5. O-O Be7 (5... b5 6. Bb3 Be7 7. Re1 d6) 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6
I'm interested in Black's fifth move in particular. The top three options, with number of games according to the lichess opening book, are
- Be7 (43,520). Described in books as going to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
- b5 (8,126). Described as going to the Arkhangelsk variation.
- Nxe4 (4,844). Open Ruy Lopez.
Now 5...Be7 is clearly the most popular choice, but after 5... b5 6. Bb3, Black could choose to transpose to the Closed Ruy Lopez with 6... Be7 (shown as a variant in the diagram above). Here are the frequencies after 6. Bb3:
- Bb7 (3,452). Arkhangelsk variation.
- Bc5 (2,827). Neo-Arkhangelsk variation.
- Be7 (1,765). Transposing back to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
My question is why is 5...Be7 overwhelmingly more popular than 5...b5? Assuming Black wants to get into the Closed Ruy Lopez, what would they lose by playing 5...b5? An argument for the latter is that by playing 5...b5, Black doesn't need to worry about the Delayed Exchange variation.
Judging by the book, the transposition is doable and some people do play it, but they are a small minority (less than 5%).
opening ruy-lopez transpositions
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
1
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
up vote
5
down vote
favorite
Here is what I've seen described as the main line of the Closed Ruy Lopez up to move 7:
[fen ""]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6
5. O-O Be7 (5... b5 6. Bb3 Be7 7. Re1 d6) 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6
I'm interested in Black's fifth move in particular. The top three options, with number of games according to the lichess opening book, are
- Be7 (43,520). Described in books as going to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
- b5 (8,126). Described as going to the Arkhangelsk variation.
- Nxe4 (4,844). Open Ruy Lopez.
Now 5...Be7 is clearly the most popular choice, but after 5... b5 6. Bb3, Black could choose to transpose to the Closed Ruy Lopez with 6... Be7 (shown as a variant in the diagram above). Here are the frequencies after 6. Bb3:
- Bb7 (3,452). Arkhangelsk variation.
- Bc5 (2,827). Neo-Arkhangelsk variation.
- Be7 (1,765). Transposing back to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
My question is why is 5...Be7 overwhelmingly more popular than 5...b5? Assuming Black wants to get into the Closed Ruy Lopez, what would they lose by playing 5...b5? An argument for the latter is that by playing 5...b5, Black doesn't need to worry about the Delayed Exchange variation.
Judging by the book, the transposition is doable and some people do play it, but they are a small minority (less than 5%).
opening ruy-lopez transpositions
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
Here is what I've seen described as the main line of the Closed Ruy Lopez up to move 7:
[fen ""]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6
5. O-O Be7 (5... b5 6. Bb3 Be7 7. Re1 d6) 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6
I'm interested in Black's fifth move in particular. The top three options, with number of games according to the lichess opening book, are
- Be7 (43,520). Described in books as going to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
- b5 (8,126). Described as going to the Arkhangelsk variation.
- Nxe4 (4,844). Open Ruy Lopez.
Now 5...Be7 is clearly the most popular choice, but after 5... b5 6. Bb3, Black could choose to transpose to the Closed Ruy Lopez with 6... Be7 (shown as a variant in the diagram above). Here are the frequencies after 6. Bb3:
- Bb7 (3,452). Arkhangelsk variation.
- Bc5 (2,827). Neo-Arkhangelsk variation.
- Be7 (1,765). Transposing back to the Closed Ruy Lopez.
My question is why is 5...Be7 overwhelmingly more popular than 5...b5? Assuming Black wants to get into the Closed Ruy Lopez, what would they lose by playing 5...b5? An argument for the latter is that by playing 5...b5, Black doesn't need to worry about the Delayed Exchange variation.
Judging by the book, the transposition is doable and some people do play it, but they are a small minority (less than 5%).
opening ruy-lopez transpositions
opening ruy-lopez transpositions
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
edited 2 hours ago
Evargalo
5,1711323
5,1711323
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
asked 4 hours ago
itub
3,2281826
3,2281826
1
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago
add a comment |Â
1
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago
1
1
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
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After 5....b5 6.Bb3 Be7, white has the strong option to play 7.d4. Now, 7....exd4 is a mistake, as white obtains a big advantage after 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5, which was played in Grischuk-Nepomniachtchi (blitz). Instead, 7....d6 is more stubborn.
In contrast, after 5....Be7, 6.d4 is relatively harmless for black, for example 6....exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5.
[StartPly "9"]
[FEN ""]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O b5 (5...Be7 6.d4?! exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5) 6.Bb3 Be7 7.d4! exd4? (7...d6) 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
After 5....b5 6.Bb3 Be7, white has the strong option to play 7.d4. Now, 7....exd4 is a mistake, as white obtains a big advantage after 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5, which was played in Grischuk-Nepomniachtchi (blitz). Instead, 7....d6 is more stubborn.
In contrast, after 5....Be7, 6.d4 is relatively harmless for black, for example 6....exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5.
[StartPly "9"]
[FEN ""]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O b5 (5...Be7 6.d4?! exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5) 6.Bb3 Be7 7.d4! exd4? (7...d6) 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
After 5....b5 6.Bb3 Be7, white has the strong option to play 7.d4. Now, 7....exd4 is a mistake, as white obtains a big advantage after 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5, which was played in Grischuk-Nepomniachtchi (blitz). Instead, 7....d6 is more stubborn.
In contrast, after 5....Be7, 6.d4 is relatively harmless for black, for example 6....exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5.
[StartPly "9"]
[FEN ""]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O b5 (5...Be7 6.d4?! exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5) 6.Bb3 Be7 7.d4! exd4? (7...d6) 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
After 5....b5 6.Bb3 Be7, white has the strong option to play 7.d4. Now, 7....exd4 is a mistake, as white obtains a big advantage after 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5, which was played in Grischuk-Nepomniachtchi (blitz). Instead, 7....d6 is more stubborn.
In contrast, after 5....Be7, 6.d4 is relatively harmless for black, for example 6....exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5.
[StartPly "9"]
[FEN ""]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O b5 (5...Be7 6.d4?! exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5) 6.Bb3 Be7 7.d4! exd4? (7...d6) 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
After 5....b5 6.Bb3 Be7, white has the strong option to play 7.d4. Now, 7....exd4 is a mistake, as white obtains a big advantage after 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5, which was played in Grischuk-Nepomniachtchi (blitz). Instead, 7....d6 is more stubborn.
In contrast, after 5....Be7, 6.d4 is relatively harmless for black, for example 6....exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5.
[StartPly "9"]
[FEN ""]
1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.O-O b5 (5...Be7 6.d4?! exd4 7.e5 Ne4 8.Re1 Nc5) 6.Bb3 Be7 7.d4! exd4? (7...d6) 8.e5 Ne4 9.Bd5
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
edited 1 hour ago
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
answered 1 hour ago
Maxwell86
4,04011137
4,04011137
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
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1
After 5...b5 6.Bb3 Be7, does White systematically goes for 7.Re1, or are there independant options, e.g. 7.d3 or 7.a4?
– Evargalo
2 hours ago
Good question! There are other options, but 7.Re1 is the most popular one. 1324 games vs 232 for d4, 77 for d3, and 67 for a4.
– itub
1 hour ago