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What's the closest RAW build possible to the Grey Mouser in 5e?
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I am of course referring to the legendary figure of Fritz Lieber's Lankhmar series (one of the things Gary Gygax said was his inspiration to invent D&D).
I am assuming this character is so off-the-hook awesome that I cannot see any way to make him using strictly RAW, but what's the closest we can get?
Some things to keep in mind:
- His acrobatics, stealth and persuasion are incredible (especially acrobatics)
- His swordsmanship is fantastic, in a finesse-sort-of-way (rapier?), and when combined with a successful acrobatic move he can hit almost anything
- He is devastating with a sling, e.g. can knock someone out or do great damage (a thing which seems outside the RAW in 5e)
- He has a custom-made bodysuit that enhances stealth, and he is very hard to hit in melee (almost un-hittable!) despite that he has no armor or shield beyond this
- He has some low-level arcane spellcasting abilities
- While he is not immune to being charmed, he is fairly resistant to it
There may be other features I am overlooking from Lieber's material, but those are the high points. What's the closest you could come in RAW?
dnd-5e rules-as-written character-creation
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
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up vote
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down vote
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I am of course referring to the legendary figure of Fritz Lieber's Lankhmar series (one of the things Gary Gygax said was his inspiration to invent D&D).
I am assuming this character is so off-the-hook awesome that I cannot see any way to make him using strictly RAW, but what's the closest we can get?
Some things to keep in mind:
- His acrobatics, stealth and persuasion are incredible (especially acrobatics)
- His swordsmanship is fantastic, in a finesse-sort-of-way (rapier?), and when combined with a successful acrobatic move he can hit almost anything
- He is devastating with a sling, e.g. can knock someone out or do great damage (a thing which seems outside the RAW in 5e)
- He has a custom-made bodysuit that enhances stealth, and he is very hard to hit in melee (almost un-hittable!) despite that he has no armor or shield beyond this
- He has some low-level arcane spellcasting abilities
- While he is not immune to being charmed, he is fairly resistant to it
There may be other features I am overlooking from Lieber's material, but those are the high points. What's the closest you could come in RAW?
dnd-5e rules-as-written character-creation
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
favorite
up vote
4
down vote
favorite
I am of course referring to the legendary figure of Fritz Lieber's Lankhmar series (one of the things Gary Gygax said was his inspiration to invent D&D).
I am assuming this character is so off-the-hook awesome that I cannot see any way to make him using strictly RAW, but what's the closest we can get?
Some things to keep in mind:
- His acrobatics, stealth and persuasion are incredible (especially acrobatics)
- His swordsmanship is fantastic, in a finesse-sort-of-way (rapier?), and when combined with a successful acrobatic move he can hit almost anything
- He is devastating with a sling, e.g. can knock someone out or do great damage (a thing which seems outside the RAW in 5e)
- He has a custom-made bodysuit that enhances stealth, and he is very hard to hit in melee (almost un-hittable!) despite that he has no armor or shield beyond this
- He has some low-level arcane spellcasting abilities
- While he is not immune to being charmed, he is fairly resistant to it
There may be other features I am overlooking from Lieber's material, but those are the high points. What's the closest you could come in RAW?
dnd-5e rules-as-written character-creation
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
I am of course referring to the legendary figure of Fritz Lieber's Lankhmar series (one of the things Gary Gygax said was his inspiration to invent D&D).
I am assuming this character is so off-the-hook awesome that I cannot see any way to make him using strictly RAW, but what's the closest we can get?
Some things to keep in mind:
- His acrobatics, stealth and persuasion are incredible (especially acrobatics)
- His swordsmanship is fantastic, in a finesse-sort-of-way (rapier?), and when combined with a successful acrobatic move he can hit almost anything
- He is devastating with a sling, e.g. can knock someone out or do great damage (a thing which seems outside the RAW in 5e)
- He has a custom-made bodysuit that enhances stealth, and he is very hard to hit in melee (almost un-hittable!) despite that he has no armor or shield beyond this
- He has some low-level arcane spellcasting abilities
- While he is not immune to being charmed, he is fairly resistant to it
There may be other features I am overlooking from Lieber's material, but those are the high points. What's the closest you could come in RAW?
dnd-5e rules-as-written character-creation
dnd-5e rules-as-written character-creation
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 6 hours ago
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
asked 7 hours ago
BigJamey
443
443
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
BigJamey is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago
add a comment |Â
1
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago
1
1
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
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oldest
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up vote
4
down vote
A high-level elf rogue arcane trickster
According to the Q&A with Gary Gygax, part 5 forum thread in 2004:
The Thief was based on Jack of Shadows (Zelazny) and Cugel (Vance) with a touch of REH’s Conan, rather than solely on the Gray Mouser. Mouser was too good a swordsman to serve as the pure model.
However, Gygax was talking about the D&D of his era, and the rules have changed much since then. Based on your requirements, the Rogue class (which in Gygax's D&D was called the Thief) with the Arcane Trickster subclass is a suitable match:
Acrobatics, stealth and persuasion: All three of these are literally class skills for the rogue.
Fantastic swordsmanship: The rogue is proficient with the rapier, as well as shortswords and longswords. D&D 5e no longer gives the fighter a higher base attack bonus than the rogue.
Devastating with a sling: The rogue has sling proficiency (as a simple weapon) and can gain Sneak Attack if he has advantage on the attack roll, even if he is not hidden from the opponent. A high level rogue can deal substantial damage with sneak attack.
Custom bodysuit and unhittable: He would require magic items for this in D&D: magical leather armor, a cloak of displacement, and a naturally very high or magically-enhanced Dexterity. For a high-level character, these magic items are plausible. An elf would also have naturally increased Dexterity.
Low-level spellcasting: The Arcane Trickster roguish archetype has low-level spellcasting.
Charm resistance: A high-level character with high Wisdom would have high saves, and magic items may enhance that further. If it's not required to make the character a human, an elf of any sort is resistant but not immune to being charmed.
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
A high-level elf rogue arcane trickster
According to the Q&A with Gary Gygax, part 5 forum thread in 2004:
The Thief was based on Jack of Shadows (Zelazny) and Cugel (Vance) with a touch of REH’s Conan, rather than solely on the Gray Mouser. Mouser was too good a swordsman to serve as the pure model.
However, Gygax was talking about the D&D of his era, and the rules have changed much since then. Based on your requirements, the Rogue class (which in Gygax's D&D was called the Thief) with the Arcane Trickster subclass is a suitable match:
Acrobatics, stealth and persuasion: All three of these are literally class skills for the rogue.
Fantastic swordsmanship: The rogue is proficient with the rapier, as well as shortswords and longswords. D&D 5e no longer gives the fighter a higher base attack bonus than the rogue.
Devastating with a sling: The rogue has sling proficiency (as a simple weapon) and can gain Sneak Attack if he has advantage on the attack roll, even if he is not hidden from the opponent. A high level rogue can deal substantial damage with sneak attack.
Custom bodysuit and unhittable: He would require magic items for this in D&D: magical leather armor, a cloak of displacement, and a naturally very high or magically-enhanced Dexterity. For a high-level character, these magic items are plausible. An elf would also have naturally increased Dexterity.
Low-level spellcasting: The Arcane Trickster roguish archetype has low-level spellcasting.
Charm resistance: A high-level character with high Wisdom would have high saves, and magic items may enhance that further. If it's not required to make the character a human, an elf of any sort is resistant but not immune to being charmed.
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
A high-level elf rogue arcane trickster
According to the Q&A with Gary Gygax, part 5 forum thread in 2004:
The Thief was based on Jack of Shadows (Zelazny) and Cugel (Vance) with a touch of REH’s Conan, rather than solely on the Gray Mouser. Mouser was too good a swordsman to serve as the pure model.
However, Gygax was talking about the D&D of his era, and the rules have changed much since then. Based on your requirements, the Rogue class (which in Gygax's D&D was called the Thief) with the Arcane Trickster subclass is a suitable match:
Acrobatics, stealth and persuasion: All three of these are literally class skills for the rogue.
Fantastic swordsmanship: The rogue is proficient with the rapier, as well as shortswords and longswords. D&D 5e no longer gives the fighter a higher base attack bonus than the rogue.
Devastating with a sling: The rogue has sling proficiency (as a simple weapon) and can gain Sneak Attack if he has advantage on the attack roll, even if he is not hidden from the opponent. A high level rogue can deal substantial damage with sneak attack.
Custom bodysuit and unhittable: He would require magic items for this in D&D: magical leather armor, a cloak of displacement, and a naturally very high or magically-enhanced Dexterity. For a high-level character, these magic items are plausible. An elf would also have naturally increased Dexterity.
Low-level spellcasting: The Arcane Trickster roguish archetype has low-level spellcasting.
Charm resistance: A high-level character with high Wisdom would have high saves, and magic items may enhance that further. If it's not required to make the character a human, an elf of any sort is resistant but not immune to being charmed.
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
A high-level elf rogue arcane trickster
According to the Q&A with Gary Gygax, part 5 forum thread in 2004:
The Thief was based on Jack of Shadows (Zelazny) and Cugel (Vance) with a touch of REH’s Conan, rather than solely on the Gray Mouser. Mouser was too good a swordsman to serve as the pure model.
However, Gygax was talking about the D&D of his era, and the rules have changed much since then. Based on your requirements, the Rogue class (which in Gygax's D&D was called the Thief) with the Arcane Trickster subclass is a suitable match:
Acrobatics, stealth and persuasion: All three of these are literally class skills for the rogue.
Fantastic swordsmanship: The rogue is proficient with the rapier, as well as shortswords and longswords. D&D 5e no longer gives the fighter a higher base attack bonus than the rogue.
Devastating with a sling: The rogue has sling proficiency (as a simple weapon) and can gain Sneak Attack if he has advantage on the attack roll, even if he is not hidden from the opponent. A high level rogue can deal substantial damage with sneak attack.
Custom bodysuit and unhittable: He would require magic items for this in D&D: magical leather armor, a cloak of displacement, and a naturally very high or magically-enhanced Dexterity. For a high-level character, these magic items are plausible. An elf would also have naturally increased Dexterity.
Low-level spellcasting: The Arcane Trickster roguish archetype has low-level spellcasting.
Charm resistance: A high-level character with high Wisdom would have high saves, and magic items may enhance that further. If it's not required to make the character a human, an elf of any sort is resistant but not immune to being charmed.
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
A high-level elf rogue arcane trickster
According to the Q&A with Gary Gygax, part 5 forum thread in 2004:
The Thief was based on Jack of Shadows (Zelazny) and Cugel (Vance) with a touch of REH’s Conan, rather than solely on the Gray Mouser. Mouser was too good a swordsman to serve as the pure model.
However, Gygax was talking about the D&D of his era, and the rules have changed much since then. Based on your requirements, the Rogue class (which in Gygax's D&D was called the Thief) with the Arcane Trickster subclass is a suitable match:
Acrobatics, stealth and persuasion: All three of these are literally class skills for the rogue.
Fantastic swordsmanship: The rogue is proficient with the rapier, as well as shortswords and longswords. D&D 5e no longer gives the fighter a higher base attack bonus than the rogue.
Devastating with a sling: The rogue has sling proficiency (as a simple weapon) and can gain Sneak Attack if he has advantage on the attack roll, even if he is not hidden from the opponent. A high level rogue can deal substantial damage with sneak attack.
Custom bodysuit and unhittable: He would require magic items for this in D&D: magical leather armor, a cloak of displacement, and a naturally very high or magically-enhanced Dexterity. For a high-level character, these magic items are plausible. An elf would also have naturally increased Dexterity.
Low-level spellcasting: The Arcane Trickster roguish archetype has low-level spellcasting.
Charm resistance: A high-level character with high Wisdom would have high saves, and magic items may enhance that further. If it's not required to make the character a human, an elf of any sort is resistant but not immune to being charmed.
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
edited 13 mins ago
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
answered 21 mins ago
Quadratic Wizard
22.9k377131
22.9k377131
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
add a comment |Â
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
Corrected. Thanks @Rubiksmoose and AntiDrondert.
– Quadratic Wizard
12 mins ago
add a comment |Â
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BigJamey is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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1
I've re-cast the question. Please consider taking it off hold? This is one of just a few characters who inspired the whole game, for crying out loud, and I want to ask how to make the character. There has to be some form of the question that is fit for this forum. Please help improve the question rather than close it, for heaven's sake.
– BigJamey
6 hours ago
@BigJamey If you include more about the character within the post itself, and describe what you need in a bit more specific terms than "this character," it's probably a workable character build question.
– Jason_c_o
4 hours ago