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Question

I wanted to play a necromancer, but I wasn't all that thrilled by my options. Wizards obviously make great necromancer, but I was drawn in another direction. A charismatic puppet master, that was my goal. I think you can make a decent Necro-Bard with the College of Lore, but I wanted something that's more specialized. So I drew some inspiration from online sources and created my own Bard College. I tried to analyze the colleges officially released by WotC in order to guide me and came up with this homebrew:

COLLEGE OF MIDNIGHT

(aka College of the Necrodancer)

Grim Secrets

When you join the College of Midnight at 3rd level, you learn the Toll
the Dead cantrip, which counts as a bard cantrip for you, but not
towards your cantrips known. You also gain proficiency in the Arcana
skill.

Additionally, when your Spellcasting feature lets you learn or replace
a bard cantrip or bard spell of 1st level or higher, you can instead
learn or replace it with a necromancy spell of your choice, and it
becomes a bard spell for you if it isnÃ¢Â€Â™t already. You must otherwise
obey all the restrictions for selecting spells, and you cannot choose
spells this way that return creatures to life.

Haunted Eyes

Also at 3rd level, you gain resistance to necrotic damage, and have
advantage on saving throws against being frightened.

Dance of the Dead

Starting at 6th level, while an undead creature under your control has an
Inspiration Die from you, it gains the following benefits:

The creatureÃ¢Â€Â™s hit point maximum is increased by an amount equal to your bard level + your Charisma modifier.

The creature adds your proficiency bonus to its attack rolls, damage rolls, and saving throws.

You may heal them with your spells and class features, ignoring any rules that would usually prevent the healing of undead creatures.
Likewise, they always count as Ã¢Â€ÂœwillingÃ¢Â€Â for your spells and class
features.

This Inspiration Die lasts indefinitely, compared to the usual
expenditure period of 10 minutes, but you lose 1 use of your Bardic
Inspiration feature for every Inspiration Die used on undead this way.

Additionally, you learn one of the following spells of your choice:
Animate Dead, Speak with Dead, or Vampiric Touch. This spell doesnÃ¢Â€Â™t
count against the number of spells you know, and you canÃ¢Â€Â™t replace it.

Rule the Still Heart

At 14th level, you become a master of commanding the dead
with your music. As an action, choose one undead you can see within 60
feet of you that can hear you. That creature must make a Charisma
saving throw against your bard spell save DC. If it fails, it becomes
friendly to you and obeys your commands until you use this feature
again.

Undead with an CR greater than half your bard level (rounded
down) have advantage on the saving throw and can repeat it at the end
of every turn.

Once you use this feature, you canÃ¢Â€Â™t use it again until you finish a
long rest.

I'm playtesting this subclass right now. We started the campaign at 3rd level and we've reached level 6 so far. Toll the Dead is my go-to damaging cantrip and I have picked up Inflict Wounds and Ray of Enfeeblement from the get-go. Neither the necrotic resistance, nor the advantage on saves against fear has come up yet. At level 5 I started to animate some dead and before level 6, all my bardic inspiration was utilized to inspire my party. Now that I'm level 6, more and more bardic inspiration gets invested in buffing undead minions.

I have never played a bard before, so I'm not sure if any of these homebrew features make sense or are over-/underpowered. So I came here to ask:

Is this homebrew Bard College balanced, compared to officially published subclasses?
If not, how can I bring it in line with other Bard Colleges?

We have an excellent Meta question on How to Ask Homebrew Balance Questions. I think it'll help you put together better homebrew, better homebrew questions, and give you results that you can use at your table. It'll also vastly increase the odds of a successful Q&A for you here. You've done a good job with some initial playtest, but I think some initial analysis by yourself would help us to focus on which features you think are more likely in need of review. — 1 min ago

Dale M 95.9k19247437 · Answer 1 · 2018-10-22 11:49:02Z

YouÃ¢Â€Â™ve put your finger on what was going through my mind as I read it - you are switching your usage of bardic inspiration.

When you repurpose a feature to do something different, if you almost always use it for the new purpose thatÃ¢Â€Â™s a sign that itÃ¢Â€Â™s overpowered. Basically, your level 6 feature is way too good and it will only get better as you level up. Compare it with the College of Lore (two extra spells known) or College of Valor (extra attack).

Your 3rd level abilities are also OP but are very situational so you may not be seeing that in your game.

The 14th level is also OP - a powerful ally for as long as you want compared to, say, being able to use bardic inspiration on one ability check (Lore).

This College is not just OP, itÃ¢Â€Â™s OTT OP.

Every Bard College gets a way to use their Bardic Inspiration for something else. The 14th level feature of the School of Necromancy is better than this 14th level feature. If the 3rd level feature is really that situational, can it really be overpowered? — 2 hours ago
@hohenheim School of Necromancy is a subclass of wizard not bard. They won't be directly balanced. — 1 hour ago
I didn not claim that they are directly balanced. I just wanted to point out, that a similar feature is available at the same level. — 1 hour ago

linksassin 1,092218 · Answer 2 · 2018-10-22 13:19:55Z

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Overall this subclass doesn't appear to be too unbalanced. Playtesting it as you are probably gives you a better idea than any of us would have purely from reading the rules.

Grim Secrets

Part one of this feature seems fine. Though no other college gain a cantrip at this level I don't feel this is fundamentally different to any of the others.

Part two is harder to guess at as it grants an ongoing improvement rather than a static benefit. To fully know if this is OP I would have to compare all necromancy spells to all bard spells and see if this adds a significant amount of power. I feel as though it may be a little over powered compared to the existing subclasses.
Potentially consider moving this to the sixth level to mirror Additional Magical Secrets of the Lore Bard.

Haunted Eyes

Advantage against fear is common enough from many sources so not a big deal. Necrotic resistance is good but situational so not game breaking.

Dance of the Dead

This feature seems to be both over powered and goes against the normal design principles. For reference the other subclasses gain at this level:

Additional Magical Secrets (Lore), two spells of your choice

Extra Attack (Valor/Swords), as it says

Mantle of Majesty (Glamour), Command as bonus action for 1 minute. Once per long rest

Fool's Insight (Satire), detect thought CHA mod per long rest

Mantle of Whispers (Whispers), situational disguise

This feature also uses Bardic Inspiration in a way that no other subclass uses them, more akin to the way superiority die are used than bardic inspiration.

This is the feature that needs the most work and I would consider scrapping entirely for something different.

Rule the still heart

This feature is fine, it could actually be considered weak since it only affect one creature per long rest and they get a saving (possibly with advantage).

A suggestion

This isn't too bad as a first attempt of the subclass. I would suggest re-doing dance of the dead. Potentially replacing it entirely. Allow me to propose a features for you, not sure if it suits 6th or 14th level better though.

Grave Humour

When an Undead Creature under your control, that you can see within 60 feet of you makes an attack roll, an ability check or saving throw, you can expend one of your uses of Bardic Inspiration, rolling a Bardic Inspiration die and adding the number rolled to the Undead's result. You must decide before the DM says whether the roll succeeds or fails.

Jay Kay 5093718 · Answer 3 · 2018-10-22 14:07:15Z

First of all, yes, this subclass seems a tad overpowered compared to official bard subclasses. I've toyed around with the idea of a necromantic bard myself, but could never quite get it how I wanted it. What you have here is interesting, but let's go through it piece by piece to see where the issues are.

First, all of the bard subclasses get an additional way to use there Bardic Inspiration at level 3, not level 6. I see why you put the ability higher, it is quite a bit more powerful than similar style abilities after all, but sticking with the standard design can be quite effective, so I'll take that into account here.

Grim Secrets

The way the ability is structured seems pretty fine. Bards don't actually get many necromancy spells, so getting a free cantrip and the ability to replace bard spells with almost any other necromancy spells seems decent. Honestly, it seems similar to how the Favored Soul sorcerer spell replacement works. You'll likely be taking the best necromancy spells available, but you won't be replacing too many because you still want the best bard spells available. The only suggestion I would make for this ability is the allow the cantrip to be either Toll the Dead or Chill Touch, the only other damaging necromancy cantrip, to add a little variety.

Haunted Eyes

While the ability itself is fine, like I said above this is the level where you're supposed to gain some way to use your Bardic Inspiration, so lets reconfigure this a bit. I like the advantage on saving throws against fear, so we'll keep that. However, the resistance to necromancy I think could be replace by an ability where you can expend a use of your Bardic Inspiration to cast a necromancy spell you know at it's lowest level, without expending a spell slot. What this essentially means is that before level 5, you'll have potentially 4-5 extra free uses of necromancy spells per long rest, while level 5 and beyond it will be per short rest due to your Font of Inspiration ability.

I feel that this reworking is a lot more effective, as it makes you much more capable of casting necromantic spells, but doesn't mean that you will ONLY be using your Bardic Inspiration for that. This is probably more powerful than the original ability you designed, but bard subclasses seem to be a little front-loaded from what I've seen, so I think it's fine.

Dance of the Dead

This is the main ability, the main schtick of the subclass, and it's really a doozy. The idea is very similar to what the Wizard gets at this level, but vastly superior to it. Instead, just use the Wizard School of Necromancy ability Undead Thralls. You essentially learn Animate Dead for free, can make more undead with the spell, their HP can be increased by an amount equal to your Bard level, and they gain your proficiency to their damage rolls. This will reign in this ability quite a bit, but I would still add something to it.

Since Bards have access to healing spells, something wizards are sorely lacking in, this ability could also state that any undead you create can be healed by your healing spells and class features. While this vastly increases the effectiveness of the ability, I feel that this reworking helps to bring the ability back into line, without making the character feel too overwhelming.

Rule the Still Heart

This ability is actually, again, remarkably similar to the ability that wizards get at this level, except more restricted since you can only use it once per long rest. In addition, most of the undead monsters currently published sit at CR 10 or lower (48 our of 67, about 70%), so at max level you should be able to use this on most undead creatures without issue. While I wouldn't personally do this, if you really want resistance to necrotic damage, this would be the place to put it, as thematically your masterful dominion over undead can also imply a masterful dominion over your own weakness, giving you resistance to the necrotic/necromantic powers you frequently play with.

This reworking should address many of the issues present in your build. While I still think it's a little overpowered for a bard subclass, I feel that it's very much in-line with what you want to play, but in such a way that it won't deny other people the spotlight, which is very important.

Note: I apologize for my garbage-looking post, I can't format to save my life. If anyone could rework my post in the proper formatting, I would greatly appreciate it.

The College of Swords also gets its alternative inspiration mechanic at Level 6. — 3 mins ago

Dale M 95.9k19247437 · Answer 4 · 2018-10-22 11:49:02Z

YouÃ¢Â€Â™ve put your finger on what was going through my mind as I read it - you are switching your usage of bardic inspiration.

When you repurpose a feature to do something different, if you almost always use it for the new purpose thatÃ¢Â€Â™s a sign that itÃ¢Â€Â™s overpowered. Basically, your level 6 feature is way too good and it will only get better as you level up. Compare it with the College of Lore (two extra spells known) or College of Valor (extra attack).

Your 3rd level abilities are also OP but are very situational so you may not be seeing that in your game.

The 14th level is also OP - a powerful ally for as long as you want compared to, say, being able to use bardic inspiration on one ability check (Lore).

This College is not just OP, itÃ¢Â€Â™s OTT OP.

Every Bard College gets a way to use their Bardic Inspiration for something else. The 14th level feature of the School of Necromancy is better than this 14th level feature. If the 3rd level feature is really that situational, can it really be overpowered? — 2 hours ago
@hohenheim School of Necromancy is a subclass of wizard not bard. They won't be directly balanced. — 1 hour ago
I didn not claim that they are directly balanced. I just wanted to point out, that a similar feature is available at the same level. — 1 hour ago

linksassin 1,092218 · Answer 5 · 2018-10-22 13:19:55Z

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Overall this subclass doesn't appear to be too unbalanced. Playtesting it as you are probably gives you a better idea than any of us would have purely from reading the rules.

Grim Secrets

Part one of this feature seems fine. Though no other college gain a cantrip at this level I don't feel this is fundamentally different to any of the others.

Part two is harder to guess at as it grants an ongoing improvement rather than a static benefit. To fully know if this is OP I would have to compare all necromancy spells to all bard spells and see if this adds a significant amount of power. I feel as though it may be a little over powered compared to the existing subclasses.
Potentially consider moving this to the sixth level to mirror Additional Magical Secrets of the Lore Bard.

Haunted Eyes

Advantage against fear is common enough from many sources so not a big deal. Necrotic resistance is good but situational so not game breaking.

Dance of the Dead

This feature seems to be both over powered and goes against the normal design principles. For reference the other subclasses gain at this level:

Additional Magical Secrets (Lore), two spells of your choice

Extra Attack (Valor/Swords), as it says

Mantle of Majesty (Glamour), Command as bonus action for 1 minute. Once per long rest

Fool's Insight (Satire), detect thought CHA mod per long rest

Mantle of Whispers (Whispers), situational disguise

This feature also uses Bardic Inspiration in a way that no other subclass uses them, more akin to the way superiority die are used than bardic inspiration.

This is the feature that needs the most work and I would consider scrapping entirely for something different.

Rule the still heart

This feature is fine, it could actually be considered weak since it only affect one creature per long rest and they get a saving (possibly with advantage).

A suggestion

This isn't too bad as a first attempt of the subclass. I would suggest re-doing dance of the dead. Potentially replacing it entirely. Allow me to propose a features for you, not sure if it suits 6th or 14th level better though.

Grave Humour

When an Undead Creature under your control, that you can see within 60 feet of you makes an attack roll, an ability check or saving throw, you can expend one of your uses of Bardic Inspiration, rolling a Bardic Inspiration die and adding the number rolled to the Undead's result. You must decide before the DM says whether the roll succeeds or fails.

Jay Kay 5093718 · Answer 6 · 2018-10-22 14:07:15Z

First of all, yes, this subclass seems a tad overpowered compared to official bard subclasses. I've toyed around with the idea of a necromantic bard myself, but could never quite get it how I wanted it. What you have here is interesting, but let's go through it piece by piece to see where the issues are.

First, all of the bard subclasses get an additional way to use there Bardic Inspiration at level 3, not level 6. I see why you put the ability higher, it is quite a bit more powerful than similar style abilities after all, but sticking with the standard design can be quite effective, so I'll take that into account here.

Grim Secrets

The way the ability is structured seems pretty fine. Bards don't actually get many necromancy spells, so getting a free cantrip and the ability to replace bard spells with almost any other necromancy spells seems decent. Honestly, it seems similar to how the Favored Soul sorcerer spell replacement works. You'll likely be taking the best necromancy spells available, but you won't be replacing too many because you still want the best bard spells available. The only suggestion I would make for this ability is the allow the cantrip to be either Toll the Dead or Chill Touch, the only other damaging necromancy cantrip, to add a little variety.

Haunted Eyes

While the ability itself is fine, like I said above this is the level where you're supposed to gain some way to use your Bardic Inspiration, so lets reconfigure this a bit. I like the advantage on saving throws against fear, so we'll keep that. However, the resistance to necromancy I think could be replace by an ability where you can expend a use of your Bardic Inspiration to cast a necromancy spell you know at it's lowest level, without expending a spell slot. What this essentially means is that before level 5, you'll have potentially 4-5 extra free uses of necromancy spells per long rest, while level 5 and beyond it will be per short rest due to your Font of Inspiration ability.

I feel that this reworking is a lot more effective, as it makes you much more capable of casting necromantic spells, but doesn't mean that you will ONLY be using your Bardic Inspiration for that. This is probably more powerful than the original ability you designed, but bard subclasses seem to be a little front-loaded from what I've seen, so I think it's fine.

Dance of the Dead

This is the main ability, the main schtick of the subclass, and it's really a doozy. The idea is very similar to what the Wizard gets at this level, but vastly superior to it. Instead, just use the Wizard School of Necromancy ability Undead Thralls. You essentially learn Animate Dead for free, can make more undead with the spell, their HP can be increased by an amount equal to your Bard level, and they gain your proficiency to their damage rolls. This will reign in this ability quite a bit, but I would still add something to it.

Since Bards have access to healing spells, something wizards are sorely lacking in, this ability could also state that any undead you create can be healed by your healing spells and class features. While this vastly increases the effectiveness of the ability, I feel that this reworking helps to bring the ability back into line, without making the character feel too overwhelming.

Rule the Still Heart

This ability is actually, again, remarkably similar to the ability that wizards get at this level, except more restricted since you can only use it once per long rest. In addition, most of the undead monsters currently published sit at CR 10 or lower (48 our of 67, about 70%), so at max level you should be able to use this on most undead creatures without issue. While I wouldn't personally do this, if you really want resistance to necrotic damage, this would be the place to put it, as thematically your masterful dominion over undead can also imply a masterful dominion over your own weakness, giving you resistance to the necrotic/necromantic powers you frequently play with.

This reworking should address many of the issues present in your build. While I still think it's a little overpowered for a bard subclass, I feel that it's very much in-line with what you want to play, but in such a way that it won't deny other people the spotlight, which is very important.

Note: I apologize for my garbage-looking post, I can't format to save my life. If anyone could rework my post in the proper formatting, I would greatly appreciate it.

The College of Swords also gets its alternative inspiration mechanic at Level 6. — 3 mins ago

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Is this homebrew Bard College balanced, compared to officially published subclasses?

COLLEGE OF MIDNIGHT

COLLEGE OF MIDNIGHT

COLLEGE OF MIDNIGHT

COLLEGE OF MIDNIGHT

3 Answers 3

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Grim Secrets

Haunted Eyes

Dance of the Dead

Rule the still heart

A suggestion

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3 Answers 3

3 Answers 3

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Grim Secrets

Haunted Eyes

Dance of the Dead

Rule the still heart

A suggestion

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Grim Secrets

Haunted Eyes

Dance of the Dead

Rule the still heart

A suggestion

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Grim Secrets

Haunted Eyes

Dance of the Dead

Rule the still heart

A suggestion

Mostly balanced except for Dance of the Dead

Grim Secrets

Haunted Eyes

Dance of the Dead

Rule the still heart

A suggestion

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