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Given immortality can animals become intelligent?
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The animal in question starts off with reptile like intelligence, classic gecko and is a singularity, the only individual of his species to be immortal.
It can die and be killed but for the sake of the question we exclude that. Degradation by oxidation, mutation, cancers, viruses don't happen.
Aging is not infinite, it stops after maturity has been reached.
Given that, can a gecko develop intelligence after living so long with a fairly small start?
Intelligence stands for being able to craft and plan ahead the most optimal ways to overcome obstacles of any type. Be it learning how to draw, climb or doing math.
biology science anatomy
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
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asked 1 hour ago
Koume
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up vote
2
down vote
favorite
The animal in question starts off with reptile like intelligence, classic gecko and is a singularity, the only individual of his species to be immortal.
It can die and be killed but for the sake of the question we exclude that. Degradation by oxidation, mutation, cancers, viruses don't happen.
Aging is not infinite, it stops after maturity has been reached.
Given that, can a gecko develop intelligence after living so long with a fairly small start?
Intelligence stands for being able to craft and plan ahead the most optimal ways to overcome obstacles of any type. Be it learning how to draw, climb or doing math.
biology science anatomy
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
1
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
1
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
The animal in question starts off with reptile like intelligence, classic gecko and is a singularity, the only individual of his species to be immortal.
It can die and be killed but for the sake of the question we exclude that. Degradation by oxidation, mutation, cancers, viruses don't happen.
Aging is not infinite, it stops after maturity has been reached.
Given that, can a gecko develop intelligence after living so long with a fairly small start?
Intelligence stands for being able to craft and plan ahead the most optimal ways to overcome obstacles of any type. Be it learning how to draw, climb or doing math.
biology science anatomy
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
The animal in question starts off with reptile like intelligence, classic gecko and is a singularity, the only individual of his species to be immortal.
It can die and be killed but for the sake of the question we exclude that. Degradation by oxidation, mutation, cancers, viruses don't happen.
Aging is not infinite, it stops after maturity has been reached.
Given that, can a gecko develop intelligence after living so long with a fairly small start?
Intelligence stands for being able to craft and plan ahead the most optimal ways to overcome obstacles of any type. Be it learning how to draw, climb or doing math.
biology science anatomy
biology science anatomy
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
edited 1 hour ago
Ash
21.3k253128
21.3k253128
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
asked 1 hour ago
Koume
112
112
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Koume is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
1
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
1
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
1
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
1
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
1
1
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
1
1
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
 |Â
show 1 more comment
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
up vote
6
down vote
Evidence suggests that no creature becomes more intelligent than it needs to be, intelligence is expensive of calories, for example human brains are about 2% of our overall mass but require 20% of our minimum calorie intake. So intelligence beyond basic survival needs is actually maladaptive for individuals and species. A gecko therefore has a biological interest in not thinking too too much.
To answer your question no, there are physical limits to how much any brain can handle and a gecko with a gecko brain is not going to be able to learn much more than your run of the mill gecko regardless of how long it lives.
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
In addition to Ash's answer:
You assume that every lifeform spends its entire life learning indefinitely. This is just plain incorrect. Not only could you look at the elderly of most species and see that at some point the intelligence does not seem to improve anymore or in some cases by tendency degrade in old age. (e.g. Humans)
But some animals learn very little in their lives. Most reptiles are very instinct-driven. They are born with their instincts and live their lives according to them from start to finish.
Not every lifeform even has the ability to learn anything. Just think about training animals. Dogs can easily learn tricks and commands. They have evolved to do that and already started at wolf-intelligence. Other animals are often very difficult to train, hence all the animal abuse scandals in the circus industry - some animals just learn certain things when forced (meaning they are basically tortured). But even then you could not teach every animal every possible trick.
Holy hell, you can't even teach every human everything. I personally know smart people with a great grasp on human psychology, history socioligy and all that, but have severe troubles with math and struggle with concepts that appear to be very basic to other people who study in engineering and science fields.
That does not mean that the math-able people are smarter or better. They are better at math. Intelligence is a very complex issue.
A reptile is not equipped to resemble human intelligence
Unless you have selective pressures favoring intelligence in these species over many, many generations they will not be even close to human intelligence - why would they?
A normal gecko not dying of old age, but well enough equipped to survive on its own has no need for intelligence. What for?
And if it cannot survive on its own then the somewhat-immortality will be of no use to it, either.
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Your intelligent geko needs to reproduce
Intelligence is obtained in a species with mutations through evolution, not making one single element living longer (some turtles can live up to 200 years, more than any human does actually, and that doesn’t make the turtles more intelligent).
The process works like this: If your geko is a little more intelligent than the other gekos, and that is an advantage in their current ecosystem, then the intelligent geko will have more chances to reproduce and distribute its “intelligent genoma†to its brood, so the intelligence can evolve IF it is an advantage for the species. But the intelligence of that geko will not raise just by living longer.
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
6
down vote
Evidence suggests that no creature becomes more intelligent than it needs to be, intelligence is expensive of calories, for example human brains are about 2% of our overall mass but require 20% of our minimum calorie intake. So intelligence beyond basic survival needs is actually maladaptive for individuals and species. A gecko therefore has a biological interest in not thinking too too much.
To answer your question no, there are physical limits to how much any brain can handle and a gecko with a gecko brain is not going to be able to learn much more than your run of the mill gecko regardless of how long it lives.
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
add a comment |Â
up vote
6
down vote
Evidence suggests that no creature becomes more intelligent than it needs to be, intelligence is expensive of calories, for example human brains are about 2% of our overall mass but require 20% of our minimum calorie intake. So intelligence beyond basic survival needs is actually maladaptive for individuals and species. A gecko therefore has a biological interest in not thinking too too much.
To answer your question no, there are physical limits to how much any brain can handle and a gecko with a gecko brain is not going to be able to learn much more than your run of the mill gecko regardless of how long it lives.
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
add a comment |Â
up vote
6
down vote
up vote
6
down vote
Evidence suggests that no creature becomes more intelligent than it needs to be, intelligence is expensive of calories, for example human brains are about 2% of our overall mass but require 20% of our minimum calorie intake. So intelligence beyond basic survival needs is actually maladaptive for individuals and species. A gecko therefore has a biological interest in not thinking too too much.
To answer your question no, there are physical limits to how much any brain can handle and a gecko with a gecko brain is not going to be able to learn much more than your run of the mill gecko regardless of how long it lives.
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
Evidence suggests that no creature becomes more intelligent than it needs to be, intelligence is expensive of calories, for example human brains are about 2% of our overall mass but require 20% of our minimum calorie intake. So intelligence beyond basic survival needs is actually maladaptive for individuals and species. A gecko therefore has a biological interest in not thinking too too much.
To answer your question no, there are physical limits to how much any brain can handle and a gecko with a gecko brain is not going to be able to learn much more than your run of the mill gecko regardless of how long it lives.
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
answered 58 mins ago
Ash
21.3k253128
21.3k253128
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
In addition to Ash's answer:
You assume that every lifeform spends its entire life learning indefinitely. This is just plain incorrect. Not only could you look at the elderly of most species and see that at some point the intelligence does not seem to improve anymore or in some cases by tendency degrade in old age. (e.g. Humans)
But some animals learn very little in their lives. Most reptiles are very instinct-driven. They are born with their instincts and live their lives according to them from start to finish.
Not every lifeform even has the ability to learn anything. Just think about training animals. Dogs can easily learn tricks and commands. They have evolved to do that and already started at wolf-intelligence. Other animals are often very difficult to train, hence all the animal abuse scandals in the circus industry - some animals just learn certain things when forced (meaning they are basically tortured). But even then you could not teach every animal every possible trick.
Holy hell, you can't even teach every human everything. I personally know smart people with a great grasp on human psychology, history socioligy and all that, but have severe troubles with math and struggle with concepts that appear to be very basic to other people who study in engineering and science fields.
That does not mean that the math-able people are smarter or better. They are better at math. Intelligence is a very complex issue.
A reptile is not equipped to resemble human intelligence
Unless you have selective pressures favoring intelligence in these species over many, many generations they will not be even close to human intelligence - why would they?
A normal gecko not dying of old age, but well enough equipped to survive on its own has no need for intelligence. What for?
And if it cannot survive on its own then the somewhat-immortality will be of no use to it, either.
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
In addition to Ash's answer:
You assume that every lifeform spends its entire life learning indefinitely. This is just plain incorrect. Not only could you look at the elderly of most species and see that at some point the intelligence does not seem to improve anymore or in some cases by tendency degrade in old age. (e.g. Humans)
But some animals learn very little in their lives. Most reptiles are very instinct-driven. They are born with their instincts and live their lives according to them from start to finish.
Not every lifeform even has the ability to learn anything. Just think about training animals. Dogs can easily learn tricks and commands. They have evolved to do that and already started at wolf-intelligence. Other animals are often very difficult to train, hence all the animal abuse scandals in the circus industry - some animals just learn certain things when forced (meaning they are basically tortured). But even then you could not teach every animal every possible trick.
Holy hell, you can't even teach every human everything. I personally know smart people with a great grasp on human psychology, history socioligy and all that, but have severe troubles with math and struggle with concepts that appear to be very basic to other people who study in engineering and science fields.
That does not mean that the math-able people are smarter or better. They are better at math. Intelligence is a very complex issue.
A reptile is not equipped to resemble human intelligence
Unless you have selective pressures favoring intelligence in these species over many, many generations they will not be even close to human intelligence - why would they?
A normal gecko not dying of old age, but well enough equipped to survive on its own has no need for intelligence. What for?
And if it cannot survive on its own then the somewhat-immortality will be of no use to it, either.
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
In addition to Ash's answer:
You assume that every lifeform spends its entire life learning indefinitely. This is just plain incorrect. Not only could you look at the elderly of most species and see that at some point the intelligence does not seem to improve anymore or in some cases by tendency degrade in old age. (e.g. Humans)
But some animals learn very little in their lives. Most reptiles are very instinct-driven. They are born with their instincts and live their lives according to them from start to finish.
Not every lifeform even has the ability to learn anything. Just think about training animals. Dogs can easily learn tricks and commands. They have evolved to do that and already started at wolf-intelligence. Other animals are often very difficult to train, hence all the animal abuse scandals in the circus industry - some animals just learn certain things when forced (meaning they are basically tortured). But even then you could not teach every animal every possible trick.
Holy hell, you can't even teach every human everything. I personally know smart people with a great grasp on human psychology, history socioligy and all that, but have severe troubles with math and struggle with concepts that appear to be very basic to other people who study in engineering and science fields.
That does not mean that the math-able people are smarter or better. They are better at math. Intelligence is a very complex issue.
A reptile is not equipped to resemble human intelligence
Unless you have selective pressures favoring intelligence in these species over many, many generations they will not be even close to human intelligence - why would they?
A normal gecko not dying of old age, but well enough equipped to survive on its own has no need for intelligence. What for?
And if it cannot survive on its own then the somewhat-immortality will be of no use to it, either.
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
In addition to Ash's answer:
You assume that every lifeform spends its entire life learning indefinitely. This is just plain incorrect. Not only could you look at the elderly of most species and see that at some point the intelligence does not seem to improve anymore or in some cases by tendency degrade in old age. (e.g. Humans)
But some animals learn very little in their lives. Most reptiles are very instinct-driven. They are born with their instincts and live their lives according to them from start to finish.
Not every lifeform even has the ability to learn anything. Just think about training animals. Dogs can easily learn tricks and commands. They have evolved to do that and already started at wolf-intelligence. Other animals are often very difficult to train, hence all the animal abuse scandals in the circus industry - some animals just learn certain things when forced (meaning they are basically tortured). But even then you could not teach every animal every possible trick.
Holy hell, you can't even teach every human everything. I personally know smart people with a great grasp on human psychology, history socioligy and all that, but have severe troubles with math and struggle with concepts that appear to be very basic to other people who study in engineering and science fields.
That does not mean that the math-able people are smarter or better. They are better at math. Intelligence is a very complex issue.
A reptile is not equipped to resemble human intelligence
Unless you have selective pressures favoring intelligence in these species over many, many generations they will not be even close to human intelligence - why would they?
A normal gecko not dying of old age, but well enough equipped to survive on its own has no need for intelligence. What for?
And if it cannot survive on its own then the somewhat-immortality will be of no use to it, either.
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
answered 16 mins ago
ArtificialSoul
4,9101439
4,9101439
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Your intelligent geko needs to reproduce
Intelligence is obtained in a species with mutations through evolution, not making one single element living longer (some turtles can live up to 200 years, more than any human does actually, and that doesn’t make the turtles more intelligent).
The process works like this: If your geko is a little more intelligent than the other gekos, and that is an advantage in their current ecosystem, then the intelligent geko will have more chances to reproduce and distribute its “intelligent genoma†to its brood, so the intelligence can evolve IF it is an advantage for the species. But the intelligence of that geko will not raise just by living longer.
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Your intelligent geko needs to reproduce
Intelligence is obtained in a species with mutations through evolution, not making one single element living longer (some turtles can live up to 200 years, more than any human does actually, and that doesn’t make the turtles more intelligent).
The process works like this: If your geko is a little more intelligent than the other gekos, and that is an advantage in their current ecosystem, then the intelligent geko will have more chances to reproduce and distribute its “intelligent genoma†to its brood, so the intelligence can evolve IF it is an advantage for the species. But the intelligence of that geko will not raise just by living longer.
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Your intelligent geko needs to reproduce
Intelligence is obtained in a species with mutations through evolution, not making one single element living longer (some turtles can live up to 200 years, more than any human does actually, and that doesn’t make the turtles more intelligent).
The process works like this: If your geko is a little more intelligent than the other gekos, and that is an advantage in their current ecosystem, then the intelligent geko will have more chances to reproduce and distribute its “intelligent genoma†to its brood, so the intelligence can evolve IF it is an advantage for the species. But the intelligence of that geko will not raise just by living longer.
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
Your intelligent geko needs to reproduce
Intelligence is obtained in a species with mutations through evolution, not making one single element living longer (some turtles can live up to 200 years, more than any human does actually, and that doesn’t make the turtles more intelligent).
The process works like this: If your geko is a little more intelligent than the other gekos, and that is an advantage in their current ecosystem, then the intelligent geko will have more chances to reproduce and distribute its “intelligent genoma†to its brood, so the intelligence can evolve IF it is an advantage for the species. But the intelligence of that geko will not raise just by living longer.
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
answered 21 mins ago
Carlos Zamora
1,498418
1,498418
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
Koume is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Koume is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
Koume is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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Hello Koume here on StackExchange! Please have a look on the tour! Are you going for an immortality without aging? Or can your reptile age?
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago
1
How do you measure gecko intelligence? What is the threshold that you would consider intelligent given your test?
– Raditz_35
1 hour ago
Age until maturity, the human equivalent of 21 not further.
– Koume
1 hour ago
The gecko is intelligent if it can learn anything, just like a person can eventually learn any skill or language with enough practice, as an example.
– Koume
1 hour ago
1
Also, do you want sentience or sapience? The difference is the following: sentience: i know that in the mirror is me. Sapience: i am using logic to deduce that the guy with the knive in the mirror behind me might not be friendly.
– DarthDonut
1 hour ago