Is Disarm an entire action, or a replacement for a single Weapon Attack?

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My confusion comes from the somewhat ambiguous wording of the Disarm action as described in the Dungeon Master's Guide:




A creature can use a weapon attack to knock a weapon or another item from a target's grasp. The attacker makes an attack roll contested by the target's Strength (Athletics) check or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect, but the defender drops the item.




Two things stand out to me:




A creature can use a weapon attack




One way to interpret this is to mean that this is replacing a normal weapon attack, disarming the target instead of dealing damage. The other way to interpret this is that this weapon attack is special; that despite being called an attack, it's intended to be its own action type.




If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect




This also stands out to me. If this were its own action, and not a replacement for a regular attack, then it wouldn't be necessary to specify that damage is negated; it would simply be presumed to deal no damage.



What is the correct way to interpret this action? Is it its own Action, or a replacement for a single Attack as part of the Attack Action? If a character gets the Extra Attack feature, can Disarm replace every attack they're otherwise allowed to make?










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    My confusion comes from the somewhat ambiguous wording of the Disarm action as described in the Dungeon Master's Guide:




    A creature can use a weapon attack to knock a weapon or another item from a target's grasp. The attacker makes an attack roll contested by the target's Strength (Athletics) check or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect, but the defender drops the item.




    Two things stand out to me:




    A creature can use a weapon attack




    One way to interpret this is to mean that this is replacing a normal weapon attack, disarming the target instead of dealing damage. The other way to interpret this is that this weapon attack is special; that despite being called an attack, it's intended to be its own action type.




    If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect




    This also stands out to me. If this were its own action, and not a replacement for a regular attack, then it wouldn't be necessary to specify that damage is negated; it would simply be presumed to deal no damage.



    What is the correct way to interpret this action? Is it its own Action, or a replacement for a single Attack as part of the Attack Action? If a character gets the Extra Attack feature, can Disarm replace every attack they're otherwise allowed to make?










    share|improve this question























      up vote
      6
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      6
      down vote

      favorite











      My confusion comes from the somewhat ambiguous wording of the Disarm action as described in the Dungeon Master's Guide:




      A creature can use a weapon attack to knock a weapon or another item from a target's grasp. The attacker makes an attack roll contested by the target's Strength (Athletics) check or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect, but the defender drops the item.




      Two things stand out to me:




      A creature can use a weapon attack




      One way to interpret this is to mean that this is replacing a normal weapon attack, disarming the target instead of dealing damage. The other way to interpret this is that this weapon attack is special; that despite being called an attack, it's intended to be its own action type.




      If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect




      This also stands out to me. If this were its own action, and not a replacement for a regular attack, then it wouldn't be necessary to specify that damage is negated; it would simply be presumed to deal no damage.



      What is the correct way to interpret this action? Is it its own Action, or a replacement for a single Attack as part of the Attack Action? If a character gets the Extra Attack feature, can Disarm replace every attack they're otherwise allowed to make?










      share|improve this question













      My confusion comes from the somewhat ambiguous wording of the Disarm action as described in the Dungeon Master's Guide:




      A creature can use a weapon attack to knock a weapon or another item from a target's grasp. The attacker makes an attack roll contested by the target's Strength (Athletics) check or Dexterity (Acrobatics) check. If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect, but the defender drops the item.




      Two things stand out to me:




      A creature can use a weapon attack




      One way to interpret this is to mean that this is replacing a normal weapon attack, disarming the target instead of dealing damage. The other way to interpret this is that this weapon attack is special; that despite being called an attack, it's intended to be its own action type.




      If the attacker wins the contest, the attack causes no damage or other ill effect




      This also stands out to me. If this were its own action, and not a replacement for a regular attack, then it wouldn't be necessary to specify that damage is negated; it would simply be presumed to deal no damage.



      What is the correct way to interpret this action? Is it its own Action, or a replacement for a single Attack as part of the Attack Action? If a character gets the Extra Attack feature, can Disarm replace every attack they're otherwise allowed to make?







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      asked 44 mins ago









      Xirema

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          3 Answers
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          It's an attack, not a separate action



          The answer is in the text you quoted:




          A creature can use a weapon attack




          If it took its own action, it would say something along the lines of "As an action, ...". The "weapon attack" wording is uniformly used to indicate that you can swap out one of your attacks for the effect.






          share|improve this answer




















          • I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
            – Carcer
            19 mins ago


















          up vote
          4
          down vote













          It isn't clear, but it's probably easiest to treat it as an attack



          The optional Disarm is listed under Action Options in the DMG (pp271). Emphasis is mine.:




          This section provides new action options for combat.




          However, as you've quoted in the text above there is the reference to:




          A creature can use a weapon attack...




          Reviewing the Options



          Looking at the other Action Options, there are some directional differences:




          • Climbing onto a Bigger Creature - Only states to use a Grapple but provides additional functionality.




            If one creature wants to jump onto another creature, it can do so by grappling





          • Shove Aside - Specifically references using the Shove attack




            With this option, a creature uses the special shove attack from the Player’s Handbook to force a target to the side, rather than away





          • Tumble Specifically states to use an action or bonus action




            As an action or a bonus action...




          This gives us some instances where they reference existing mechanics and some where they say it's an entire action.



          Unfortunately, neither is really specified for the Disarm, unless you take the "use a weapon attack", which would be perfectly reasonable, as the reason for doing so.



          Recommendation: it's a weapon attack



          I think this makes the most sense. There is only one example of these Actions that actually take an action, so we can use that type of language to guide us.



          As Disarm doesn't have that and it does state "use a weapon attack" is sufficient to suggest that it's just an attack and not a full action.






          share|improve this answer





























            up vote
            1
            down vote













            The entire Action is used to Disarm



            My reasoning is the inclusion of the specific text on the Grapple action




            When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a Special melee Attack, a grapple. If you’re able to make multiple attacks with the Attack action, this Attack replaces one of them.




            Emphasis mine. The same wording appears on the Shove action. This is not specified for the Disarm action.



            I believe the reason Disarm is a "weapon attack" that deals no damage is that it requires a weapon, an enemy within reach, and all other limitations and requirements of a weapon attack.






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              3 Answers
              3






              active

              oldest

              votes








              3 Answers
              3






              active

              oldest

              votes









              active

              oldest

              votes






              active

              oldest

              votes








              up vote
              4
              down vote













              It's an attack, not a separate action



              The answer is in the text you quoted:




              A creature can use a weapon attack




              If it took its own action, it would say something along the lines of "As an action, ...". The "weapon attack" wording is uniformly used to indicate that you can swap out one of your attacks for the effect.






              share|improve this answer




















              • I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
                – Carcer
                19 mins ago















              up vote
              4
              down vote













              It's an attack, not a separate action



              The answer is in the text you quoted:




              A creature can use a weapon attack




              If it took its own action, it would say something along the lines of "As an action, ...". The "weapon attack" wording is uniformly used to indicate that you can swap out one of your attacks for the effect.






              share|improve this answer




















              • I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
                – Carcer
                19 mins ago













              up vote
              4
              down vote










              up vote
              4
              down vote









              It's an attack, not a separate action



              The answer is in the text you quoted:




              A creature can use a weapon attack




              If it took its own action, it would say something along the lines of "As an action, ...". The "weapon attack" wording is uniformly used to indicate that you can swap out one of your attacks for the effect.






              share|improve this answer












              It's an attack, not a separate action



              The answer is in the text you quoted:




              A creature can use a weapon attack




              If it took its own action, it would say something along the lines of "As an action, ...". The "weapon attack" wording is uniformly used to indicate that you can swap out one of your attacks for the effect.







              share|improve this answer












              share|improve this answer



              share|improve this answer










              answered 24 mins ago









              Xanthir

              790210




              790210











              • I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
                – Carcer
                19 mins ago

















              • I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
                – Carcer
                19 mins ago
















              I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
              – Carcer
              19 mins ago





              I think is the way it's meant, too - the answer would be improved if we can provide a concrete example of another rule where the same wording is used to mean this, though.
              – Carcer
              19 mins ago













              up vote
              4
              down vote













              It isn't clear, but it's probably easiest to treat it as an attack



              The optional Disarm is listed under Action Options in the DMG (pp271). Emphasis is mine.:




              This section provides new action options for combat.




              However, as you've quoted in the text above there is the reference to:




              A creature can use a weapon attack...




              Reviewing the Options



              Looking at the other Action Options, there are some directional differences:




              • Climbing onto a Bigger Creature - Only states to use a Grapple but provides additional functionality.




                If one creature wants to jump onto another creature, it can do so by grappling





              • Shove Aside - Specifically references using the Shove attack




                With this option, a creature uses the special shove attack from the Player’s Handbook to force a target to the side, rather than away





              • Tumble Specifically states to use an action or bonus action




                As an action or a bonus action...




              This gives us some instances where they reference existing mechanics and some where they say it's an entire action.



              Unfortunately, neither is really specified for the Disarm, unless you take the "use a weapon attack", which would be perfectly reasonable, as the reason for doing so.



              Recommendation: it's a weapon attack



              I think this makes the most sense. There is only one example of these Actions that actually take an action, so we can use that type of language to guide us.



              As Disarm doesn't have that and it does state "use a weapon attack" is sufficient to suggest that it's just an attack and not a full action.






              share|improve this answer


























                up vote
                4
                down vote













                It isn't clear, but it's probably easiest to treat it as an attack



                The optional Disarm is listed under Action Options in the DMG (pp271). Emphasis is mine.:




                This section provides new action options for combat.




                However, as you've quoted in the text above there is the reference to:




                A creature can use a weapon attack...




                Reviewing the Options



                Looking at the other Action Options, there are some directional differences:




                • Climbing onto a Bigger Creature - Only states to use a Grapple but provides additional functionality.




                  If one creature wants to jump onto another creature, it can do so by grappling





                • Shove Aside - Specifically references using the Shove attack




                  With this option, a creature uses the special shove attack from the Player’s Handbook to force a target to the side, rather than away





                • Tumble Specifically states to use an action or bonus action




                  As an action or a bonus action...




                This gives us some instances where they reference existing mechanics and some where they say it's an entire action.



                Unfortunately, neither is really specified for the Disarm, unless you take the "use a weapon attack", which would be perfectly reasonable, as the reason for doing so.



                Recommendation: it's a weapon attack



                I think this makes the most sense. There is only one example of these Actions that actually take an action, so we can use that type of language to guide us.



                As Disarm doesn't have that and it does state "use a weapon attack" is sufficient to suggest that it's just an attack and not a full action.






                share|improve this answer
























                  up vote
                  4
                  down vote










                  up vote
                  4
                  down vote









                  It isn't clear, but it's probably easiest to treat it as an attack



                  The optional Disarm is listed under Action Options in the DMG (pp271). Emphasis is mine.:




                  This section provides new action options for combat.




                  However, as you've quoted in the text above there is the reference to:




                  A creature can use a weapon attack...




                  Reviewing the Options



                  Looking at the other Action Options, there are some directional differences:




                  • Climbing onto a Bigger Creature - Only states to use a Grapple but provides additional functionality.




                    If one creature wants to jump onto another creature, it can do so by grappling





                  • Shove Aside - Specifically references using the Shove attack




                    With this option, a creature uses the special shove attack from the Player’s Handbook to force a target to the side, rather than away





                  • Tumble Specifically states to use an action or bonus action




                    As an action or a bonus action...




                  This gives us some instances where they reference existing mechanics and some where they say it's an entire action.



                  Unfortunately, neither is really specified for the Disarm, unless you take the "use a weapon attack", which would be perfectly reasonable, as the reason for doing so.



                  Recommendation: it's a weapon attack



                  I think this makes the most sense. There is only one example of these Actions that actually take an action, so we can use that type of language to guide us.



                  As Disarm doesn't have that and it does state "use a weapon attack" is sufficient to suggest that it's just an attack and not a full action.






                  share|improve this answer














                  It isn't clear, but it's probably easiest to treat it as an attack



                  The optional Disarm is listed under Action Options in the DMG (pp271). Emphasis is mine.:




                  This section provides new action options for combat.




                  However, as you've quoted in the text above there is the reference to:




                  A creature can use a weapon attack...




                  Reviewing the Options



                  Looking at the other Action Options, there are some directional differences:




                  • Climbing onto a Bigger Creature - Only states to use a Grapple but provides additional functionality.




                    If one creature wants to jump onto another creature, it can do so by grappling





                  • Shove Aside - Specifically references using the Shove attack




                    With this option, a creature uses the special shove attack from the Player’s Handbook to force a target to the side, rather than away





                  • Tumble Specifically states to use an action or bonus action




                    As an action or a bonus action...




                  This gives us some instances where they reference existing mechanics and some where they say it's an entire action.



                  Unfortunately, neither is really specified for the Disarm, unless you take the "use a weapon attack", which would be perfectly reasonable, as the reason for doing so.



                  Recommendation: it's a weapon attack



                  I think this makes the most sense. There is only one example of these Actions that actually take an action, so we can use that type of language to guide us.



                  As Disarm doesn't have that and it does state "use a weapon attack" is sufficient to suggest that it's just an attack and not a full action.







                  share|improve this answer














                  share|improve this answer



                  share|improve this answer








                  edited 2 mins ago

























                  answered 18 mins ago









                  NautArch

                  44.9k6162309




                  44.9k6162309




















                      up vote
                      1
                      down vote













                      The entire Action is used to Disarm



                      My reasoning is the inclusion of the specific text on the Grapple action




                      When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a Special melee Attack, a grapple. If you’re able to make multiple attacks with the Attack action, this Attack replaces one of them.




                      Emphasis mine. The same wording appears on the Shove action. This is not specified for the Disarm action.



                      I believe the reason Disarm is a "weapon attack" that deals no damage is that it requires a weapon, an enemy within reach, and all other limitations and requirements of a weapon attack.






                      share|improve this answer


























                        up vote
                        1
                        down vote













                        The entire Action is used to Disarm



                        My reasoning is the inclusion of the specific text on the Grapple action




                        When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a Special melee Attack, a grapple. If you’re able to make multiple attacks with the Attack action, this Attack replaces one of them.




                        Emphasis mine. The same wording appears on the Shove action. This is not specified for the Disarm action.



                        I believe the reason Disarm is a "weapon attack" that deals no damage is that it requires a weapon, an enemy within reach, and all other limitations and requirements of a weapon attack.






                        share|improve this answer
























                          up vote
                          1
                          down vote










                          up vote
                          1
                          down vote









                          The entire Action is used to Disarm



                          My reasoning is the inclusion of the specific text on the Grapple action




                          When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a Special melee Attack, a grapple. If you’re able to make multiple attacks with the Attack action, this Attack replaces one of them.




                          Emphasis mine. The same wording appears on the Shove action. This is not specified for the Disarm action.



                          I believe the reason Disarm is a "weapon attack" that deals no damage is that it requires a weapon, an enemy within reach, and all other limitations and requirements of a weapon attack.






                          share|improve this answer














                          The entire Action is used to Disarm



                          My reasoning is the inclusion of the specific text on the Grapple action




                          When you want to grab a creature or wrestle with it, you can use the Attack action to make a Special melee Attack, a grapple. If you’re able to make multiple attacks with the Attack action, this Attack replaces one of them.




                          Emphasis mine. The same wording appears on the Shove action. This is not specified for the Disarm action.



                          I believe the reason Disarm is a "weapon attack" that deals no damage is that it requires a weapon, an enemy within reach, and all other limitations and requirements of a weapon attack.







                          share|improve this answer














                          share|improve this answer



                          share|improve this answer








                          edited 13 mins ago

























                          answered 22 mins ago









                          Sir Cinnamon

                          4,4051240




                          4,4051240



























                               

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