How similar have terms to be to connect them with 與, 與其,及其?

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I often want to make my sentences short in order to pass our classroom exercise of writing a 簡體 abstract from memory in under 5 minutes. The biggest problem seems to be that I use 與,及其,與其,in inadmissible places.



The info we were given says, 與 can be used to connect nominal, adjectival and verbal phrases, with the first ones being the norm.



“与”较多连接名词性词语,也可连接动词性、
形容词性词语,多用于书面语,书名、标题中常见。


Some people accepted




  1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。



others wanted to replace 與 with 並。



The following was rejected explicitly on the grounds of the terms of 美國 and 美國的政治方法 being 不同類。




2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。




Would it be better to use this?




2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。




On youdao there are sentences such as:




2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。




Which I would assume to be exactly the type of 2b, particularly regarding similarity of terms (which I perhaps misunderstand). What about this?




3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。




What about replacing 與其 with 及其?




3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。











share|improve this question



























    up vote
    1
    down vote

    favorite












    I often want to make my sentences short in order to pass our classroom exercise of writing a 簡體 abstract from memory in under 5 minutes. The biggest problem seems to be that I use 與,及其,與其,in inadmissible places.



    The info we were given says, 與 can be used to connect nominal, adjectival and verbal phrases, with the first ones being the norm.



    “与”较多连接名词性词语,也可连接动词性、
    形容词性词语,多用于书面语,书名、标题中常见。


    Some people accepted




    1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。



    others wanted to replace 與 with 並。



    The following was rejected explicitly on the grounds of the terms of 美國 and 美國的政治方法 being 不同類。




    2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。




    Would it be better to use this?




    2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。




    On youdao there are sentences such as:




    2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。




    Which I would assume to be exactly the type of 2b, particularly regarding similarity of terms (which I perhaps misunderstand). What about this?




    3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。




    What about replacing 與其 with 及其?




    3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。











    share|improve this question

























      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      1
      down vote

      favorite











      I often want to make my sentences short in order to pass our classroom exercise of writing a 簡體 abstract from memory in under 5 minutes. The biggest problem seems to be that I use 與,及其,與其,in inadmissible places.



      The info we were given says, 與 can be used to connect nominal, adjectival and verbal phrases, with the first ones being the norm.



      “与”较多连接名词性词语,也可连接动词性、
      形容词性词语,多用于书面语,书名、标题中常见。


      Some people accepted




      1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。



      others wanted to replace 與 with 並。



      The following was rejected explicitly on the grounds of the terms of 美國 and 美國的政治方法 being 不同類。




      2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。




      Would it be better to use this?




      2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。




      On youdao there are sentences such as:




      2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。




      Which I would assume to be exactly the type of 2b, particularly regarding similarity of terms (which I perhaps misunderstand). What about this?




      3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。




      What about replacing 與其 with 及其?




      3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。











      share|improve this question















      I often want to make my sentences short in order to pass our classroom exercise of writing a 簡體 abstract from memory in under 5 minutes. The biggest problem seems to be that I use 與,及其,與其,in inadmissible places.



      The info we were given says, 與 can be used to connect nominal, adjectival and verbal phrases, with the first ones being the norm.



      “与”较多连接名词性词语,也可连接动词性、
      形容词性词语,多用于书面语,书名、标题中常见。


      Some people accepted




      1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。



      others wanted to replace 與 with 並。



      The following was rejected explicitly on the grounds of the terms of 美國 and 美國的政治方法 being 不同類。




      2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。




      Would it be better to use this?




      2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。




      On youdao there are sentences such as:




      2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。




      Which I would assume to be exactly the type of 2b, particularly regarding similarity of terms (which I perhaps misunderstand). What about this?




      3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。




      What about replacing 與其 with 及其?




      3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。








      conjunction






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      edited 5 hours ago

























      asked 6 hours ago









      Ludi

      1,137617




      1,137617




















          2 Answers
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          與: 和,and;



          與其: 和他的, and one's;



          及其: 还有他的,and also one's;



          Back to your examples:




          1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。// fine

          2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。// wrong as the reason you said



          2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。// fine, [research on America and its methodology of politics].



          2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。 // fine, [take pictures for this house and also its courtyard.]



          3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。// wrong, the same reason as 2a



          3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。// fine, [disagree/disapprove the leader of ... and also his courses.]







          share|improve this answer




















          • So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
            – Ludi
            5 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
            – dan
            4 hours ago






          • 2




            與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
            – Tang Ho
            3 hours ago










          • yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            40 mins ago

















          up vote
          1
          down vote













          "與其" ought to be translated as "rather than".



          this term was used since classical chinese times, together with "不如", "不若", "寧" or "寧可". it's usage in modern vernacular Chinese should be similar.



          i don't think that "與其" means "and it's / one's".



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?o=dcbdic&searchid=Z00000163825



          about some of your sentences:




          從該日起在此居住與唸書




          自該日起在此留學



          "留學" - 居留 & 學習




          該研究美國及其政治方法




          "政治方法", imo, is odd, i would prefer "政制" or "政治制度" (political system)



          btw, "該研究" is also odd, does it mean "such research"?




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化魁首及其課程



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?ccd=RvYdcM&o=e0&sec=sec1&op=v&view=1-1



          i hate "的".






          share|improve this answer




















          • Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
            – Ludi
            26 mins ago






          • 1




            @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            15 mins ago










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          2 Answers
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          2 Answers
          2






          active

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          oldest

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          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          1
          down vote













          與: 和,and;



          與其: 和他的, and one's;



          及其: 还有他的,and also one's;



          Back to your examples:




          1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。// fine

          2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。// wrong as the reason you said



          2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。// fine, [research on America and its methodology of politics].



          2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。 // fine, [take pictures for this house and also its courtyard.]



          3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。// wrong, the same reason as 2a



          3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。// fine, [disagree/disapprove the leader of ... and also his courses.]







          share|improve this answer




















          • So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
            – Ludi
            5 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
            – dan
            4 hours ago






          • 2




            與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
            – Tang Ho
            3 hours ago










          • yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            40 mins ago














          up vote
          1
          down vote













          與: 和,and;



          與其: 和他的, and one's;



          及其: 还有他的,and also one's;



          Back to your examples:




          1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。// fine

          2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。// wrong as the reason you said



          2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。// fine, [research on America and its methodology of politics].



          2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。 // fine, [take pictures for this house and also its courtyard.]



          3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。// wrong, the same reason as 2a



          3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。// fine, [disagree/disapprove the leader of ... and also his courses.]







          share|improve this answer




















          • So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
            – Ludi
            5 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
            – dan
            4 hours ago






          • 2




            與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
            – Tang Ho
            3 hours ago










          • yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            40 mins ago












          up vote
          1
          down vote










          up vote
          1
          down vote









          與: 和,and;



          與其: 和他的, and one's;



          及其: 还有他的,and also one's;



          Back to your examples:




          1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。// fine

          2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。// wrong as the reason you said



          2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。// fine, [research on America and its methodology of politics].



          2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。 // fine, [take pictures for this house and also its courtyard.]



          3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。// wrong, the same reason as 2a



          3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。// fine, [disagree/disapprove the leader of ... and also his courses.]







          share|improve this answer












          與: 和,and;



          與其: 和他的, and one's;



          及其: 还有他的,and also one's;



          Back to your examples:




          1. 從該日起在此居住與唸書。// fine

          2a.該研究美國與其政治方法。// wrong as the reason you said



          2b. 該研究美國及其政治方法。// fine, [research on America and its methodology of politics].



          2c. 我们很乐意为这所房子及其庭院拍照。 // fine, [take pictures for this house and also its courtyard.]



          3a. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人與其課程。// wrong, the same reason as 2a



          3b. 辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程。// fine, [disagree/disapprove the leader of ... and also his courses.]








          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 5 hours ago









          dan

          9,9981315




          9,9981315











          • So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
            – Ludi
            5 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
            – dan
            4 hours ago






          • 2




            與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
            – Tang Ho
            3 hours ago










          • yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            40 mins ago
















          • So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
            – Ludi
            5 hours ago






          • 1




            @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
            – dan
            4 hours ago






          • 2




            與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
            – Tang Ho
            3 hours ago










          • yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            40 mins ago















          So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
          – Ludi
          5 hours ago




          So it seems 及其 can be applied much broadly! So basically 與其 is only for cases like 黃大人與其太太?
          – Ludi
          5 hours ago




          1




          1




          @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
          – dan
          4 hours ago




          @Ludi, I think so. 與其 is used less than 及其 from my experience. Maybe, it's a different case for people from other regions. For 黃某人與其太太, we usually just say: 黃某人和他的太太.
          – dan
          4 hours ago




          2




          2




          與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
          – Tang Ho
          3 hours ago




          與其 cantonese.sheik.co.uk/dictionary/words/1885 has other meaning in different context, when it's placement is different : rather than... / 與其 A 不如 B (rather than A, better to B)
          – Tang Ho
          3 hours ago












          yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
          – æ°´å··å­‘è »
          40 mins ago




          yes, "與其" should be translated as "rather than"
          – æ°´å··å­‘è »
          40 mins ago










          up vote
          1
          down vote













          "與其" ought to be translated as "rather than".



          this term was used since classical chinese times, together with "不如", "不若", "寧" or "寧可". it's usage in modern vernacular Chinese should be similar.



          i don't think that "與其" means "and it's / one's".



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?o=dcbdic&searchid=Z00000163825



          about some of your sentences:




          從該日起在此居住與唸書




          自該日起在此留學



          "留學" - 居留 & 學習




          該研究美國及其政治方法




          "政治方法", imo, is odd, i would prefer "政制" or "政治制度" (political system)



          btw, "該研究" is also odd, does it mean "such research"?




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化魁首及其課程



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?ccd=RvYdcM&o=e0&sec=sec1&op=v&view=1-1



          i hate "的".






          share|improve this answer




















          • Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
            – Ludi
            26 mins ago






          • 1




            @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            15 mins ago














          up vote
          1
          down vote













          "與其" ought to be translated as "rather than".



          this term was used since classical chinese times, together with "不如", "不若", "寧" or "寧可". it's usage in modern vernacular Chinese should be similar.



          i don't think that "與其" means "and it's / one's".



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?o=dcbdic&searchid=Z00000163825



          about some of your sentences:




          從該日起在此居住與唸書




          自該日起在此留學



          "留學" - 居留 & 學習




          該研究美國及其政治方法




          "政治方法", imo, is odd, i would prefer "政制" or "政治制度" (political system)



          btw, "該研究" is also odd, does it mean "such research"?




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化魁首及其課程



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?ccd=RvYdcM&o=e0&sec=sec1&op=v&view=1-1



          i hate "的".






          share|improve this answer




















          • Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
            – Ludi
            26 mins ago






          • 1




            @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            15 mins ago












          up vote
          1
          down vote










          up vote
          1
          down vote









          "與其" ought to be translated as "rather than".



          this term was used since classical chinese times, together with "不如", "不若", "寧" or "寧可". it's usage in modern vernacular Chinese should be similar.



          i don't think that "與其" means "and it's / one's".



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?o=dcbdic&searchid=Z00000163825



          about some of your sentences:




          從該日起在此居住與唸書




          自該日起在此留學



          "留學" - 居留 & 學習




          該研究美國及其政治方法




          "政治方法", imo, is odd, i would prefer "政制" or "政治制度" (political system)



          btw, "該研究" is also odd, does it mean "such research"?




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化魁首及其課程



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?ccd=RvYdcM&o=e0&sec=sec1&op=v&view=1-1



          i hate "的".






          share|improve this answer












          "與其" ought to be translated as "rather than".



          this term was used since classical chinese times, together with "不如", "不若", "寧" or "寧可". it's usage in modern vernacular Chinese should be similar.



          i don't think that "與其" means "and it's / one's".



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?o=dcbdic&searchid=Z00000163825



          about some of your sentences:




          從該日起在此居住與唸書




          自該日起在此留學



          "留學" - 居留 & 學習




          該研究美國及其政治方法




          "政治方法", imo, is odd, i would prefer "政制" or "政治制度" (political system)



          btw, "該研究" is also odd, does it mean "such research"?




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化的帶頭人及其課程




          辜鴻銘不認可胡適這位新文化魁首及其課程



          http://dict.revised.moe.edu.tw/cgi-bin/cbdic/gsweb.cgi?ccd=RvYdcM&o=e0&sec=sec1&op=v&view=1-1



          i hate "的".







          share|improve this answer












          share|improve this answer



          share|improve this answer










          answered 40 mins ago









          水巷孑蠻

          6,7371520




          6,7371520











          • Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
            – Ludi
            26 mins ago






          • 1




            @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            15 mins ago
















          • Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
            – Ludi
            26 mins ago






          • 1




            @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
            – æ°´å··å­‘è »
            15 mins ago















          Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
          – Ludi
          26 mins ago




          Many thanks! 該 was supposed to mean 應該。I cut out a lot of characters, so that I can write the entire thing in under 5 minutes. The teachers sentence was: 胡適說,中國什麼都沒有西方好,所以中國一定不可以再這樣了。要學習美國,中國必須用美國政治的辦法,因為,美國政治的辦法最好!My attempt of a summary in written Chinese was: 他認為中國各方面都不如美國,該研究美國及其政治方法。
          – Ludi
          26 mins ago




          1




          1




          @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
          – æ°´å··å­‘è »
          15 mins ago




          @ludi, i would try something like: 胡適認為中國比不上美國.應向其學習.研究其政制 :)
          – æ°´å··å­‘è »
          15 mins ago

















           

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