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Can the hit point maximum be reduced repeatedly with multiple Harm spells?
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I know that the effects of a spell don’t combine if it is cast multiple times. Only the most potent effect would be applied. In our last game, this topic came up in regards to the Harm spell. Harm was cast on an opponent. He failed the save, took a lot of damage and his hit point maximum was reduced drastically. A turn later, he got slammed again with Harm. This time, he succeeded on the save and very little necrotic damage was dealt. Then, the discussion started whether his hit point maximum would now be further reduced or if the “more potent†Harm spell tales precedence.
Naturally, I argued that his hit point maximum would not be reduced further, because effects of the same spell cast multiple times don’t stack. The counterargument was, that the necrotic damage dealt by the Harm spell is clearly an effect of the spell. And no one would argue, that the damage dealt by two consecutive Harm spells would only be applied once. So now I ask you:
Can the hit point maximum be reduced repeatedly with multiple Harm spells?
dnd-5e spells hit-points
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
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hohenheim
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up vote
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I know that the effects of a spell don’t combine if it is cast multiple times. Only the most potent effect would be applied. In our last game, this topic came up in regards to the Harm spell. Harm was cast on an opponent. He failed the save, took a lot of damage and his hit point maximum was reduced drastically. A turn later, he got slammed again with Harm. This time, he succeeded on the save and very little necrotic damage was dealt. Then, the discussion started whether his hit point maximum would now be further reduced or if the “more potent†Harm spell tales precedence.
Naturally, I argued that his hit point maximum would not be reduced further, because effects of the same spell cast multiple times don’t stack. The counterargument was, that the necrotic damage dealt by the Harm spell is clearly an effect of the spell. And no one would argue, that the damage dealt by two consecutive Harm spells would only be applied once. So now I ask you:
Can the hit point maximum be reduced repeatedly with multiple Harm spells?
dnd-5e spells hit-points
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
I know that the effects of a spell don’t combine if it is cast multiple times. Only the most potent effect would be applied. In our last game, this topic came up in regards to the Harm spell. Harm was cast on an opponent. He failed the save, took a lot of damage and his hit point maximum was reduced drastically. A turn later, he got slammed again with Harm. This time, he succeeded on the save and very little necrotic damage was dealt. Then, the discussion started whether his hit point maximum would now be further reduced or if the “more potent†Harm spell tales precedence.
Naturally, I argued that his hit point maximum would not be reduced further, because effects of the same spell cast multiple times don’t stack. The counterargument was, that the necrotic damage dealt by the Harm spell is clearly an effect of the spell. And no one would argue, that the damage dealt by two consecutive Harm spells would only be applied once. So now I ask you:
Can the hit point maximum be reduced repeatedly with multiple Harm spells?
dnd-5e spells hit-points
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
I know that the effects of a spell don’t combine if it is cast multiple times. Only the most potent effect would be applied. In our last game, this topic came up in regards to the Harm spell. Harm was cast on an opponent. He failed the save, took a lot of damage and his hit point maximum was reduced drastically. A turn later, he got slammed again with Harm. This time, he succeeded on the save and very little necrotic damage was dealt. Then, the discussion started whether his hit point maximum would now be further reduced or if the “more potent†Harm spell tales precedence.
Naturally, I argued that his hit point maximum would not be reduced further, because effects of the same spell cast multiple times don’t stack. The counterargument was, that the necrotic damage dealt by the Harm spell is clearly an effect of the spell. And no one would argue, that the damage dealt by two consecutive Harm spells would only be applied once. So now I ask you:
Can the hit point maximum be reduced repeatedly with multiple Harm spells?
dnd-5e spells hit-points
dnd-5e spells hit-points
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
edited 50 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
17.3k671187
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
asked 53 mins ago
hohenheim
1,849739
1,849739
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
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The target's maximum hit points will only be reduced once
From Harm (PHB, pg. 249):
If the target fails the saving throw, its hit point maximum is reduced for 1 hour by an amount equal to the necrotic damage it took. Any effect that removes a disease allows a creature's hit point maximum to return to normal before that time passes.
Combining Magical Effects, from the PHB (pg. 254):
The effects of different spells add together while the durations of those spells overlap. The effects of the same spell cast multiple times don't combine, however. Instead, the most potent effect - such as the highest bonus - from those castings applies while their durations overlap.
So multiple castings of the same spell will not stack, but rather the one that dealt the largest amount of damage would take precedence. This rule applies because the hit point reduction has a duration attached to it, unlike, say, a Wraith's Life Drain (MM, pg. 302), which is an ongoing affect (albeit with a end condition):
... its hit point maximum is reduced by an amount equal to the damage taken. This reduction lasts until the target finishes a long rest.
Of course, this doesn't stop the target's maximum hit points from being reduced further by something other than the Harm spell...
This is essentially the argument you presented at your table, but I see no reason that this wouldn't apply.
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
5
down vote
The target's maximum hit points will only be reduced once
From Harm (PHB, pg. 249):
If the target fails the saving throw, its hit point maximum is reduced for 1 hour by an amount equal to the necrotic damage it took. Any effect that removes a disease allows a creature's hit point maximum to return to normal before that time passes.
Combining Magical Effects, from the PHB (pg. 254):
The effects of different spells add together while the durations of those spells overlap. The effects of the same spell cast multiple times don't combine, however. Instead, the most potent effect - such as the highest bonus - from those castings applies while their durations overlap.
So multiple castings of the same spell will not stack, but rather the one that dealt the largest amount of damage would take precedence. This rule applies because the hit point reduction has a duration attached to it, unlike, say, a Wraith's Life Drain (MM, pg. 302), which is an ongoing affect (albeit with a end condition):
... its hit point maximum is reduced by an amount equal to the damage taken. This reduction lasts until the target finishes a long rest.
Of course, this doesn't stop the target's maximum hit points from being reduced further by something other than the Harm spell...
This is essentially the argument you presented at your table, but I see no reason that this wouldn't apply.
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
The target's maximum hit points will only be reduced once
From Harm (PHB, pg. 249):
If the target fails the saving throw, its hit point maximum is reduced for 1 hour by an amount equal to the necrotic damage it took. Any effect that removes a disease allows a creature's hit point maximum to return to normal before that time passes.
Combining Magical Effects, from the PHB (pg. 254):
The effects of different spells add together while the durations of those spells overlap. The effects of the same spell cast multiple times don't combine, however. Instead, the most potent effect - such as the highest bonus - from those castings applies while their durations overlap.
So multiple castings of the same spell will not stack, but rather the one that dealt the largest amount of damage would take precedence. This rule applies because the hit point reduction has a duration attached to it, unlike, say, a Wraith's Life Drain (MM, pg. 302), which is an ongoing affect (albeit with a end condition):
... its hit point maximum is reduced by an amount equal to the damage taken. This reduction lasts until the target finishes a long rest.
Of course, this doesn't stop the target's maximum hit points from being reduced further by something other than the Harm spell...
This is essentially the argument you presented at your table, but I see no reason that this wouldn't apply.
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
up vote
5
down vote
The target's maximum hit points will only be reduced once
From Harm (PHB, pg. 249):
If the target fails the saving throw, its hit point maximum is reduced for 1 hour by an amount equal to the necrotic damage it took. Any effect that removes a disease allows a creature's hit point maximum to return to normal before that time passes.
Combining Magical Effects, from the PHB (pg. 254):
The effects of different spells add together while the durations of those spells overlap. The effects of the same spell cast multiple times don't combine, however. Instead, the most potent effect - such as the highest bonus - from those castings applies while their durations overlap.
So multiple castings of the same spell will not stack, but rather the one that dealt the largest amount of damage would take precedence. This rule applies because the hit point reduction has a duration attached to it, unlike, say, a Wraith's Life Drain (MM, pg. 302), which is an ongoing affect (albeit with a end condition):
... its hit point maximum is reduced by an amount equal to the damage taken. This reduction lasts until the target finishes a long rest.
Of course, this doesn't stop the target's maximum hit points from being reduced further by something other than the Harm spell...
This is essentially the argument you presented at your table, but I see no reason that this wouldn't apply.
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
The target's maximum hit points will only be reduced once
From Harm (PHB, pg. 249):
If the target fails the saving throw, its hit point maximum is reduced for 1 hour by an amount equal to the necrotic damage it took. Any effect that removes a disease allows a creature's hit point maximum to return to normal before that time passes.
Combining Magical Effects, from the PHB (pg. 254):
The effects of different spells add together while the durations of those spells overlap. The effects of the same spell cast multiple times don't combine, however. Instead, the most potent effect - such as the highest bonus - from those castings applies while their durations overlap.
So multiple castings of the same spell will not stack, but rather the one that dealt the largest amount of damage would take precedence. This rule applies because the hit point reduction has a duration attached to it, unlike, say, a Wraith's Life Drain (MM, pg. 302), which is an ongoing affect (albeit with a end condition):
... its hit point maximum is reduced by an amount equal to the damage taken. This reduction lasts until the target finishes a long rest.
Of course, this doesn't stop the target's maximum hit points from being reduced further by something other than the Harm spell...
This is essentially the argument you presented at your table, but I see no reason that this wouldn't apply.
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
edited 37 mins ago
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
answered 48 mins ago
NathanS
17.3k671187
17.3k671187
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
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