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Whence unicorns?
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I have a story in a mediaeval setting with no magic. There are elves, but they are essentially just absurdly long-lived versions of humans with pointy ears and somewhat more acute senses.
Unicorns are central to the story. They are roughly horse-shaped, though there is no need for them to be equids—in fact, I'm toying with the idea to give them cloven hooves. Naturally, they have long, fluffy hair and elegant spiral horns. I see no issues with any of that.
The problem is, they are fiendishly intelligent, on a par with people. That, too, is key to the story, but I just can't convince myself that animals that can't use tools and live fairly standard ruminant lives would evolve this kind of intelligence. Show me that I'm wrong, won't you?
reality-check evolution mythical-creatures unicorns
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
I have a story in a mediaeval setting with no magic. There are elves, but they are essentially just absurdly long-lived versions of humans with pointy ears and somewhat more acute senses.
Unicorns are central to the story. They are roughly horse-shaped, though there is no need for them to be equids—in fact, I'm toying with the idea to give them cloven hooves. Naturally, they have long, fluffy hair and elegant spiral horns. I see no issues with any of that.
The problem is, they are fiendishly intelligent, on a par with people. That, too, is key to the story, but I just can't convince myself that animals that can't use tools and live fairly standard ruminant lives would evolve this kind of intelligence. Show me that I'm wrong, won't you?
reality-check evolution mythical-creatures unicorns
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
I have a story in a mediaeval setting with no magic. There are elves, but they are essentially just absurdly long-lived versions of humans with pointy ears and somewhat more acute senses.
Unicorns are central to the story. They are roughly horse-shaped, though there is no need for them to be equids—in fact, I'm toying with the idea to give them cloven hooves. Naturally, they have long, fluffy hair and elegant spiral horns. I see no issues with any of that.
The problem is, they are fiendishly intelligent, on a par with people. That, too, is key to the story, but I just can't convince myself that animals that can't use tools and live fairly standard ruminant lives would evolve this kind of intelligence. Show me that I'm wrong, won't you?
reality-check evolution mythical-creatures unicorns
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
I have a story in a mediaeval setting with no magic. There are elves, but they are essentially just absurdly long-lived versions of humans with pointy ears and somewhat more acute senses.
Unicorns are central to the story. They are roughly horse-shaped, though there is no need for them to be equids—in fact, I'm toying with the idea to give them cloven hooves. Naturally, they have long, fluffy hair and elegant spiral horns. I see no issues with any of that.
The problem is, they are fiendishly intelligent, on a par with people. That, too, is key to the story, but I just can't convince myself that animals that can't use tools and live fairly standard ruminant lives would evolve this kind of intelligence. Show me that I'm wrong, won't you?
reality-check evolution mythical-creatures unicorns
reality-check evolution mythical-creatures unicorns
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
asked 1 hour ago
Tumbislav
44627
44627
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
up vote
3
down vote
Intelligence has a lot of components, and there are driving evolutionary forces to increase them
Memory It is argued by evolutionary biologists that the complex fruit-based diet of primates requires a good long-term memory to remember where to find good food sources
Social structure Some intelligence is necessary to maintain a complex social structure.
Hunting Carnivores are usually more intelligent than herbivores
Language Having a language requires a lot of intelligence, but using it is evolutionary very efficient
Tools only come as an afterthought. Whatever their body allows, you may detect some tool usage on your unicorns (e.g., a stick handled with the mouth)
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
The problem with this is that we only have humans to go on for human-level intelligence. There are many highly intelligent creatures including but not limited to primates, crows, dolphins, and octopodes.
If intelligence on this level is what you're after, then there is your proof that an animal can achieve that level of intelligence. For higher intelligence, we're forced to look at what it is believed to be the reasons behind human intelligence.
There are several theories regarding the importance of intelligence in humans during evolution.
Tree life
One theory being that in order to sleep in trees without falling out, we had to have higher brain functions. If our ancestors fell out of the trees, they could seriously injure themselves or get eaten by a predator. Bad things happened otherwise. Unicorns don't sleep in trees traditionally (though maybe yours do, but I'll assume that's not your case).
Tribe
Another theory being that it was very much in the interests of survival to make friends and therefore be social. Higher brain functions are required to be able to recognize many faces and have many friends. If you had few friends which took care of you, eventually they may die off leaving you to fend for yourself, and being alone for the type of lifestyle which our ancestors had was a rough life to be sure. There was strength in numbers. Your unicorns may move in packs, but that's not quite the same as being social. They would need to be able to communicate in some fashion, perhaps using a highly sophisticated calling mechanism? Hmm, I'm not honestly convinced of this.
Tools
The traditionally believed reason behind modern human intelligence has been the usage of tools. In fact for a long time, it was believed the use of tools was a unique trait of human intelligence and what distinguished us from other animals. We now know this is no longer the case. Crows have been found to use sticks to obtain items out of reach, for instance. Although this isn't a unique trait, it could still be that the need for more advanced tools such as spears and knives meant the difference between being cold and hungry and being clothed and well-fed. Unicorns obviously cannot use tools, so I think we're also going to have to exclude this possibility.
Conclusion
Unicorns don't quite fit the description of these theories, and as such, none of the same conditions exist for a unicorn which existed for our ancestors. Though perhaps it is incorrect to base conclusions on the intelligence of human beings, however this is all we have to base ourselves with.
I hate to say it, but I'm in agreement with your sentiment that such animals could not have human level intelligence. It could be quite clever without being as intelligent as human beings, but it could never equal our intelligence without otherwise meeting some of these conditions in my humble opinion.
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
 |Â
show 2 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
3
down vote
Intelligence has a lot of components, and there are driving evolutionary forces to increase them
Memory It is argued by evolutionary biologists that the complex fruit-based diet of primates requires a good long-term memory to remember where to find good food sources
Social structure Some intelligence is necessary to maintain a complex social structure.
Hunting Carnivores are usually more intelligent than herbivores
Language Having a language requires a lot of intelligence, but using it is evolutionary very efficient
Tools only come as an afterthought. Whatever their body allows, you may detect some tool usage on your unicorns (e.g., a stick handled with the mouth)
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Intelligence has a lot of components, and there are driving evolutionary forces to increase them
Memory It is argued by evolutionary biologists that the complex fruit-based diet of primates requires a good long-term memory to remember where to find good food sources
Social structure Some intelligence is necessary to maintain a complex social structure.
Hunting Carnivores are usually more intelligent than herbivores
Language Having a language requires a lot of intelligence, but using it is evolutionary very efficient
Tools only come as an afterthought. Whatever their body allows, you may detect some tool usage on your unicorns (e.g., a stick handled with the mouth)
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
Intelligence has a lot of components, and there are driving evolutionary forces to increase them
Memory It is argued by evolutionary biologists that the complex fruit-based diet of primates requires a good long-term memory to remember where to find good food sources
Social structure Some intelligence is necessary to maintain a complex social structure.
Hunting Carnivores are usually more intelligent than herbivores
Language Having a language requires a lot of intelligence, but using it is evolutionary very efficient
Tools only come as an afterthought. Whatever their body allows, you may detect some tool usage on your unicorns (e.g., a stick handled with the mouth)
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
Intelligence has a lot of components, and there are driving evolutionary forces to increase them
Memory It is argued by evolutionary biologists that the complex fruit-based diet of primates requires a good long-term memory to remember where to find good food sources
Social structure Some intelligence is necessary to maintain a complex social structure.
Hunting Carnivores are usually more intelligent than herbivores
Language Having a language requires a lot of intelligence, but using it is evolutionary very efficient
Tools only come as an afterthought. Whatever their body allows, you may detect some tool usage on your unicorns (e.g., a stick handled with the mouth)
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
answered 51 mins ago
jknappen
2,5521928
2,5521928
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
The problem with this is that we only have humans to go on for human-level intelligence. There are many highly intelligent creatures including but not limited to primates, crows, dolphins, and octopodes.
If intelligence on this level is what you're after, then there is your proof that an animal can achieve that level of intelligence. For higher intelligence, we're forced to look at what it is believed to be the reasons behind human intelligence.
There are several theories regarding the importance of intelligence in humans during evolution.
Tree life
One theory being that in order to sleep in trees without falling out, we had to have higher brain functions. If our ancestors fell out of the trees, they could seriously injure themselves or get eaten by a predator. Bad things happened otherwise. Unicorns don't sleep in trees traditionally (though maybe yours do, but I'll assume that's not your case).
Tribe
Another theory being that it was very much in the interests of survival to make friends and therefore be social. Higher brain functions are required to be able to recognize many faces and have many friends. If you had few friends which took care of you, eventually they may die off leaving you to fend for yourself, and being alone for the type of lifestyle which our ancestors had was a rough life to be sure. There was strength in numbers. Your unicorns may move in packs, but that's not quite the same as being social. They would need to be able to communicate in some fashion, perhaps using a highly sophisticated calling mechanism? Hmm, I'm not honestly convinced of this.
Tools
The traditionally believed reason behind modern human intelligence has been the usage of tools. In fact for a long time, it was believed the use of tools was a unique trait of human intelligence and what distinguished us from other animals. We now know this is no longer the case. Crows have been found to use sticks to obtain items out of reach, for instance. Although this isn't a unique trait, it could still be that the need for more advanced tools such as spears and knives meant the difference between being cold and hungry and being clothed and well-fed. Unicorns obviously cannot use tools, so I think we're also going to have to exclude this possibility.
Conclusion
Unicorns don't quite fit the description of these theories, and as such, none of the same conditions exist for a unicorn which existed for our ancestors. Though perhaps it is incorrect to base conclusions on the intelligence of human beings, however this is all we have to base ourselves with.
I hate to say it, but I'm in agreement with your sentiment that such animals could not have human level intelligence. It could be quite clever without being as intelligent as human beings, but it could never equal our intelligence without otherwise meeting some of these conditions in my humble opinion.
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
 |Â
show 2 more comments
up vote
3
down vote
The problem with this is that we only have humans to go on for human-level intelligence. There are many highly intelligent creatures including but not limited to primates, crows, dolphins, and octopodes.
If intelligence on this level is what you're after, then there is your proof that an animal can achieve that level of intelligence. For higher intelligence, we're forced to look at what it is believed to be the reasons behind human intelligence.
There are several theories regarding the importance of intelligence in humans during evolution.
Tree life
One theory being that in order to sleep in trees without falling out, we had to have higher brain functions. If our ancestors fell out of the trees, they could seriously injure themselves or get eaten by a predator. Bad things happened otherwise. Unicorns don't sleep in trees traditionally (though maybe yours do, but I'll assume that's not your case).
Tribe
Another theory being that it was very much in the interests of survival to make friends and therefore be social. Higher brain functions are required to be able to recognize many faces and have many friends. If you had few friends which took care of you, eventually they may die off leaving you to fend for yourself, and being alone for the type of lifestyle which our ancestors had was a rough life to be sure. There was strength in numbers. Your unicorns may move in packs, but that's not quite the same as being social. They would need to be able to communicate in some fashion, perhaps using a highly sophisticated calling mechanism? Hmm, I'm not honestly convinced of this.
Tools
The traditionally believed reason behind modern human intelligence has been the usage of tools. In fact for a long time, it was believed the use of tools was a unique trait of human intelligence and what distinguished us from other animals. We now know this is no longer the case. Crows have been found to use sticks to obtain items out of reach, for instance. Although this isn't a unique trait, it could still be that the need for more advanced tools such as spears and knives meant the difference between being cold and hungry and being clothed and well-fed. Unicorns obviously cannot use tools, so I think we're also going to have to exclude this possibility.
Conclusion
Unicorns don't quite fit the description of these theories, and as such, none of the same conditions exist for a unicorn which existed for our ancestors. Though perhaps it is incorrect to base conclusions on the intelligence of human beings, however this is all we have to base ourselves with.
I hate to say it, but I'm in agreement with your sentiment that such animals could not have human level intelligence. It could be quite clever without being as intelligent as human beings, but it could never equal our intelligence without otherwise meeting some of these conditions in my humble opinion.
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
 |Â
show 2 more comments
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
The problem with this is that we only have humans to go on for human-level intelligence. There are many highly intelligent creatures including but not limited to primates, crows, dolphins, and octopodes.
If intelligence on this level is what you're after, then there is your proof that an animal can achieve that level of intelligence. For higher intelligence, we're forced to look at what it is believed to be the reasons behind human intelligence.
There are several theories regarding the importance of intelligence in humans during evolution.
Tree life
One theory being that in order to sleep in trees without falling out, we had to have higher brain functions. If our ancestors fell out of the trees, they could seriously injure themselves or get eaten by a predator. Bad things happened otherwise. Unicorns don't sleep in trees traditionally (though maybe yours do, but I'll assume that's not your case).
Tribe
Another theory being that it was very much in the interests of survival to make friends and therefore be social. Higher brain functions are required to be able to recognize many faces and have many friends. If you had few friends which took care of you, eventually they may die off leaving you to fend for yourself, and being alone for the type of lifestyle which our ancestors had was a rough life to be sure. There was strength in numbers. Your unicorns may move in packs, but that's not quite the same as being social. They would need to be able to communicate in some fashion, perhaps using a highly sophisticated calling mechanism? Hmm, I'm not honestly convinced of this.
Tools
The traditionally believed reason behind modern human intelligence has been the usage of tools. In fact for a long time, it was believed the use of tools was a unique trait of human intelligence and what distinguished us from other animals. We now know this is no longer the case. Crows have been found to use sticks to obtain items out of reach, for instance. Although this isn't a unique trait, it could still be that the need for more advanced tools such as spears and knives meant the difference between being cold and hungry and being clothed and well-fed. Unicorns obviously cannot use tools, so I think we're also going to have to exclude this possibility.
Conclusion
Unicorns don't quite fit the description of these theories, and as such, none of the same conditions exist for a unicorn which existed for our ancestors. Though perhaps it is incorrect to base conclusions on the intelligence of human beings, however this is all we have to base ourselves with.
I hate to say it, but I'm in agreement with your sentiment that such animals could not have human level intelligence. It could be quite clever without being as intelligent as human beings, but it could never equal our intelligence without otherwise meeting some of these conditions in my humble opinion.
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
The problem with this is that we only have humans to go on for human-level intelligence. There are many highly intelligent creatures including but not limited to primates, crows, dolphins, and octopodes.
If intelligence on this level is what you're after, then there is your proof that an animal can achieve that level of intelligence. For higher intelligence, we're forced to look at what it is believed to be the reasons behind human intelligence.
There are several theories regarding the importance of intelligence in humans during evolution.
Tree life
One theory being that in order to sleep in trees without falling out, we had to have higher brain functions. If our ancestors fell out of the trees, they could seriously injure themselves or get eaten by a predator. Bad things happened otherwise. Unicorns don't sleep in trees traditionally (though maybe yours do, but I'll assume that's not your case).
Tribe
Another theory being that it was very much in the interests of survival to make friends and therefore be social. Higher brain functions are required to be able to recognize many faces and have many friends. If you had few friends which took care of you, eventually they may die off leaving you to fend for yourself, and being alone for the type of lifestyle which our ancestors had was a rough life to be sure. There was strength in numbers. Your unicorns may move in packs, but that's not quite the same as being social. They would need to be able to communicate in some fashion, perhaps using a highly sophisticated calling mechanism? Hmm, I'm not honestly convinced of this.
Tools
The traditionally believed reason behind modern human intelligence has been the usage of tools. In fact for a long time, it was believed the use of tools was a unique trait of human intelligence and what distinguished us from other animals. We now know this is no longer the case. Crows have been found to use sticks to obtain items out of reach, for instance. Although this isn't a unique trait, it could still be that the need for more advanced tools such as spears and knives meant the difference between being cold and hungry and being clothed and well-fed. Unicorns obviously cannot use tools, so I think we're also going to have to exclude this possibility.
Conclusion
Unicorns don't quite fit the description of these theories, and as such, none of the same conditions exist for a unicorn which existed for our ancestors. Though perhaps it is incorrect to base conclusions on the intelligence of human beings, however this is all we have to base ourselves with.
I hate to say it, but I'm in agreement with your sentiment that such animals could not have human level intelligence. It could be quite clever without being as intelligent as human beings, but it could never equal our intelligence without otherwise meeting some of these conditions in my humble opinion.
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
edited 30 mins ago
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
answered 54 mins ago
Neil
3,6971223
3,6971223
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
 |Â
show 2 more comments
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Birds manage to sleep in tree branches without the need for a human level of intelligence. I think we can rule this out.
– Rekesoft
42 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Thanks. The tribe argument is the one that works best in the context of my story.
– Tumbislav
41 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
Did you mean octopodes rather than octopedes? Spiders aren't known for their intelligence
– Separatrix
35 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Separatrix Ah, you're right, my mistake. Correcting..
– Neil
30 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
@Rekesoft I'd like to see a bird weighing 60kg consistently sleep on a tree branch without requiring any higher level functions.
– Neil
28 mins ago
 |Â
show 2 more comments
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