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Wondering if electrician is scamming me on panel replacement
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Had an electrician over to do some work. No problem with that work.
While there he said my electrical panel was aluminum based and I may want to replace with copper. Later he said when he opened it up he saw signs it should be replaced and that copper would be advisable.
I realize every case is different and certainly if there are bad signs I should very it fixed.
But here are some of my concerns.
1) They said they could use the same city permit ($450 here) for both jobs. Sounds like such great news, but also seems it may be a way to convinced me to do the work NOW?
2) They said I have an aluminum panel that should be replaced and would be better to have copper. I don't know how to check for that and also I've tried researching this and have not found much online about "replacing aluminum panels". As far as I know my house wiring is copper. Also, I have had zero issues with breakers tripping in the house. As in never. Sure, that could be a bad sign if there were actual problems but I have no reason to think there are.
Oh, I'm not sure how old the panel is but it could be 20-25 years old. So I suppose that's relevant.
3) Price for replacement with copper panel,, $4,150 plus tax. $4500 if I want to include a surge protector. Seems a lot higher than I've read about online as general guideline though I realize prices can be regional and there's s lot of construction around here (Seattle) these days.
Will be hard to get other estimates before work is to be done so maybe I should delay the work until I can? That sounds reasonable but then I'll likely need a new permit? Perhaps worth it to be sure I'm not being scammed?
electrical electrical-panel
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
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up vote
1
down vote
favorite
Had an electrician over to do some work. No problem with that work.
While there he said my electrical panel was aluminum based and I may want to replace with copper. Later he said when he opened it up he saw signs it should be replaced and that copper would be advisable.
I realize every case is different and certainly if there are bad signs I should very it fixed.
But here are some of my concerns.
1) They said they could use the same city permit ($450 here) for both jobs. Sounds like such great news, but also seems it may be a way to convinced me to do the work NOW?
2) They said I have an aluminum panel that should be replaced and would be better to have copper. I don't know how to check for that and also I've tried researching this and have not found much online about "replacing aluminum panels". As far as I know my house wiring is copper. Also, I have had zero issues with breakers tripping in the house. As in never. Sure, that could be a bad sign if there were actual problems but I have no reason to think there are.
Oh, I'm not sure how old the panel is but it could be 20-25 years old. So I suppose that's relevant.
3) Price for replacement with copper panel,, $4,150 plus tax. $4500 if I want to include a surge protector. Seems a lot higher than I've read about online as general guideline though I realize prices can be regional and there's s lot of construction around here (Seattle) these days.
Will be hard to get other estimates before work is to be done so maybe I should delay the work until I can? That sounds reasonable but then I'll likely need a new permit? Perhaps worth it to be sure I'm not being scammed?
electrical electrical-panel
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
3
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
Had an electrician over to do some work. No problem with that work.
While there he said my electrical panel was aluminum based and I may want to replace with copper. Later he said when he opened it up he saw signs it should be replaced and that copper would be advisable.
I realize every case is different and certainly if there are bad signs I should very it fixed.
But here are some of my concerns.
1) They said they could use the same city permit ($450 here) for both jobs. Sounds like such great news, but also seems it may be a way to convinced me to do the work NOW?
2) They said I have an aluminum panel that should be replaced and would be better to have copper. I don't know how to check for that and also I've tried researching this and have not found much online about "replacing aluminum panels". As far as I know my house wiring is copper. Also, I have had zero issues with breakers tripping in the house. As in never. Sure, that could be a bad sign if there were actual problems but I have no reason to think there are.
Oh, I'm not sure how old the panel is but it could be 20-25 years old. So I suppose that's relevant.
3) Price for replacement with copper panel,, $4,150 plus tax. $4500 if I want to include a surge protector. Seems a lot higher than I've read about online as general guideline though I realize prices can be regional and there's s lot of construction around here (Seattle) these days.
Will be hard to get other estimates before work is to be done so maybe I should delay the work until I can? That sounds reasonable but then I'll likely need a new permit? Perhaps worth it to be sure I'm not being scammed?
electrical electrical-panel
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Had an electrician over to do some work. No problem with that work.
While there he said my electrical panel was aluminum based and I may want to replace with copper. Later he said when he opened it up he saw signs it should be replaced and that copper would be advisable.
I realize every case is different and certainly if there are bad signs I should very it fixed.
But here are some of my concerns.
1) They said they could use the same city permit ($450 here) for both jobs. Sounds like such great news, but also seems it may be a way to convinced me to do the work NOW?
2) They said I have an aluminum panel that should be replaced and would be better to have copper. I don't know how to check for that and also I've tried researching this and have not found much online about "replacing aluminum panels". As far as I know my house wiring is copper. Also, I have had zero issues with breakers tripping in the house. As in never. Sure, that could be a bad sign if there were actual problems but I have no reason to think there are.
Oh, I'm not sure how old the panel is but it could be 20-25 years old. So I suppose that's relevant.
3) Price for replacement with copper panel,, $4,150 plus tax. $4500 if I want to include a surge protector. Seems a lot higher than I've read about online as general guideline though I realize prices can be regional and there's s lot of construction around here (Seattle) these days.
Will be hard to get other estimates before work is to be done so maybe I should delay the work until I can? That sounds reasonable but then I'll likely need a new permit? Perhaps worth it to be sure I'm not being scammed?
electrical electrical-panel
electrical electrical-panel
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
asked 5 hours ago
BruceK
61
61
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
BruceK is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
3
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago
add a comment |Â
1
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
3
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago
1
1
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
3
3
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
Less expensive panels can be aluminum, if it is a brand still manufactured today I would not change it. If it is a brand like zinsco I might replace it if the buss shows signs of arcing. Talking price is off topic here but if you have copper wire that price sounds way high for just replacing a panel. Did he tell you that you have to bring things up to current code if you replace the panel in most cases arc fault and GFCI's , tamper resistant outlets and weather resistant GFCI'S with in use Or extra duty covers. I am in Oregon and some of the requirements are waived for just a panel but I would want to know the scope of work first, just a panel is an easy day job in most cases so this sounds high to me.
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Sounds like it's over priced and not necessary. Aluminum buss bars are a valid option for main panels and reduce the price significantly. I'm not sure of your installation but many times materials are less than $500 for a typical 40 slot installation with breakers. It is a full day's job to complete though. I would look elsewhere for quotes.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
I'm sure the electrician told you a lot more than that... But the aluminum thing is what stuck. There was a problem in the 1970s with shoddy use of aluminum wire on receptacles (wire terminations/clamps) that had not been proeperly approved for aluminum, and this resulted in a lot of arc problems which led to house fires. That is ancient history, but there is still an ooga-booga fear, moral panic style, over any aluminum wire of any kind. If you are enthralled in this fear, certainly a shoddy electrician could scare you into doing unnecessary work by mentioning the A-word.
The aluminum excuse is balderdash. Actually you want service and feeder lugs to be aluminum, since aluminum lugs are the universal donor - they work with Aluminum and Copper both. Copper lugs don't play nice with aluminum wire (and actually that was the problem all along). Many feeders and almost all service conductors (all large wires) are aluminum, and it's the right choice for those.
Even today, aluminum is not used for small branch circuits (lights, sockets, dryer etc.) because of the previous ooga-booga. The alloy has been improved, the now-noncopper terminations have been vastly improved, and it's legal... Just nobody does it.
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
Less expensive panels can be aluminum, if it is a brand still manufactured today I would not change it. If it is a brand like zinsco I might replace it if the buss shows signs of arcing. Talking price is off topic here but if you have copper wire that price sounds way high for just replacing a panel. Did he tell you that you have to bring things up to current code if you replace the panel in most cases arc fault and GFCI's , tamper resistant outlets and weather resistant GFCI'S with in use Or extra duty covers. I am in Oregon and some of the requirements are waived for just a panel but I would want to know the scope of work first, just a panel is an easy day job in most cases so this sounds high to me.
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
Less expensive panels can be aluminum, if it is a brand still manufactured today I would not change it. If it is a brand like zinsco I might replace it if the buss shows signs of arcing. Talking price is off topic here but if you have copper wire that price sounds way high for just replacing a panel. Did he tell you that you have to bring things up to current code if you replace the panel in most cases arc fault and GFCI's , tamper resistant outlets and weather resistant GFCI'S with in use Or extra duty covers. I am in Oregon and some of the requirements are waived for just a panel but I would want to know the scope of work first, just a panel is an easy day job in most cases so this sounds high to me.
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
Less expensive panels can be aluminum, if it is a brand still manufactured today I would not change it. If it is a brand like zinsco I might replace it if the buss shows signs of arcing. Talking price is off topic here but if you have copper wire that price sounds way high for just replacing a panel. Did he tell you that you have to bring things up to current code if you replace the panel in most cases arc fault and GFCI's , tamper resistant outlets and weather resistant GFCI'S with in use Or extra duty covers. I am in Oregon and some of the requirements are waived for just a panel but I would want to know the scope of work first, just a panel is an easy day job in most cases so this sounds high to me.
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
Less expensive panels can be aluminum, if it is a brand still manufactured today I would not change it. If it is a brand like zinsco I might replace it if the buss shows signs of arcing. Talking price is off topic here but if you have copper wire that price sounds way high for just replacing a panel. Did he tell you that you have to bring things up to current code if you replace the panel in most cases arc fault and GFCI's , tamper resistant outlets and weather resistant GFCI'S with in use Or extra duty covers. I am in Oregon and some of the requirements are waived for just a panel but I would want to know the scope of work first, just a panel is an easy day job in most cases so this sounds high to me.
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
answered 2 hours ago
Ed Beal
24.8k11535
24.8k11535
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Sounds like it's over priced and not necessary. Aluminum buss bars are a valid option for main panels and reduce the price significantly. I'm not sure of your installation but many times materials are less than $500 for a typical 40 slot installation with breakers. It is a full day's job to complete though. I would look elsewhere for quotes.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Sounds like it's over priced and not necessary. Aluminum buss bars are a valid option for main panels and reduce the price significantly. I'm not sure of your installation but many times materials are less than $500 for a typical 40 slot installation with breakers. It is a full day's job to complete though. I would look elsewhere for quotes.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
Sounds like it's over priced and not necessary. Aluminum buss bars are a valid option for main panels and reduce the price significantly. I'm not sure of your installation but many times materials are less than $500 for a typical 40 slot installation with breakers. It is a full day's job to complete though. I would look elsewhere for quotes.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Sounds like it's over priced and not necessary. Aluminum buss bars are a valid option for main panels and reduce the price significantly. I'm not sure of your installation but many times materials are less than $500 for a typical 40 slot installation with breakers. It is a full day's job to complete though. I would look elsewhere for quotes.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
answered 4 hours ago
Steven Martz
111
111
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
Steven Martz is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
I'm sure the electrician told you a lot more than that... But the aluminum thing is what stuck. There was a problem in the 1970s with shoddy use of aluminum wire on receptacles (wire terminations/clamps) that had not been proeperly approved for aluminum, and this resulted in a lot of arc problems which led to house fires. That is ancient history, but there is still an ooga-booga fear, moral panic style, over any aluminum wire of any kind. If you are enthralled in this fear, certainly a shoddy electrician could scare you into doing unnecessary work by mentioning the A-word.
The aluminum excuse is balderdash. Actually you want service and feeder lugs to be aluminum, since aluminum lugs are the universal donor - they work with Aluminum and Copper both. Copper lugs don't play nice with aluminum wire (and actually that was the problem all along). Many feeders and almost all service conductors (all large wires) are aluminum, and it's the right choice for those.
Even today, aluminum is not used for small branch circuits (lights, sockets, dryer etc.) because of the previous ooga-booga. The alloy has been improved, the now-noncopper terminations have been vastly improved, and it's legal... Just nobody does it.
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
I'm sure the electrician told you a lot more than that... But the aluminum thing is what stuck. There was a problem in the 1970s with shoddy use of aluminum wire on receptacles (wire terminations/clamps) that had not been proeperly approved for aluminum, and this resulted in a lot of arc problems which led to house fires. That is ancient history, but there is still an ooga-booga fear, moral panic style, over any aluminum wire of any kind. If you are enthralled in this fear, certainly a shoddy electrician could scare you into doing unnecessary work by mentioning the A-word.
The aluminum excuse is balderdash. Actually you want service and feeder lugs to be aluminum, since aluminum lugs are the universal donor - they work with Aluminum and Copper both. Copper lugs don't play nice with aluminum wire (and actually that was the problem all along). Many feeders and almost all service conductors (all large wires) are aluminum, and it's the right choice for those.
Even today, aluminum is not used for small branch circuits (lights, sockets, dryer etc.) because of the previous ooga-booga. The alloy has been improved, the now-noncopper terminations have been vastly improved, and it's legal... Just nobody does it.
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
I'm sure the electrician told you a lot more than that... But the aluminum thing is what stuck. There was a problem in the 1970s with shoddy use of aluminum wire on receptacles (wire terminations/clamps) that had not been proeperly approved for aluminum, and this resulted in a lot of arc problems which led to house fires. That is ancient history, but there is still an ooga-booga fear, moral panic style, over any aluminum wire of any kind. If you are enthralled in this fear, certainly a shoddy electrician could scare you into doing unnecessary work by mentioning the A-word.
The aluminum excuse is balderdash. Actually you want service and feeder lugs to be aluminum, since aluminum lugs are the universal donor - they work with Aluminum and Copper both. Copper lugs don't play nice with aluminum wire (and actually that was the problem all along). Many feeders and almost all service conductors (all large wires) are aluminum, and it's the right choice for those.
Even today, aluminum is not used for small branch circuits (lights, sockets, dryer etc.) because of the previous ooga-booga. The alloy has been improved, the now-noncopper terminations have been vastly improved, and it's legal... Just nobody does it.
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
I'm sure the electrician told you a lot more than that... But the aluminum thing is what stuck. There was a problem in the 1970s with shoddy use of aluminum wire on receptacles (wire terminations/clamps) that had not been proeperly approved for aluminum, and this resulted in a lot of arc problems which led to house fires. That is ancient history, but there is still an ooga-booga fear, moral panic style, over any aluminum wire of any kind. If you are enthralled in this fear, certainly a shoddy electrician could scare you into doing unnecessary work by mentioning the A-word.
The aluminum excuse is balderdash. Actually you want service and feeder lugs to be aluminum, since aluminum lugs are the universal donor - they work with Aluminum and Copper both. Copper lugs don't play nice with aluminum wire (and actually that was the problem all along). Many feeders and almost all service conductors (all large wires) are aluminum, and it's the right choice for those.
Even today, aluminum is not used for small branch circuits (lights, sockets, dryer etc.) because of the previous ooga-booga. The alloy has been improved, the now-noncopper terminations have been vastly improved, and it's legal... Just nobody does it.
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
answered 19 mins ago
Harper
55.7k334113
55.7k334113
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
BruceK is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
BruceK is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
BruceK is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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1
Welcome to DIY.SE! Can you post pictures of your current panel?
– mmathis
5 hours ago
3
Pics should show the sticker inside the panel to show mfgr and model; important to know what mfgr.
– Jim Stewart
5 hours ago