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Did Bach ever use melodic minor keys in chorales?
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For example, E Melodic Minor would have C#, allowing for a ii7-V-I cadence.
theory harmony chord-progressions key j-s-bach
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For example, E Melodic Minor would have C#, allowing for a ii7-V-I cadence.
theory harmony chord-progressions key j-s-bach
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
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asked 3 hours ago
user53092
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user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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up vote
1
down vote
favorite
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
For example, E Melodic Minor would have C#, allowing for a ii7-V-I cadence.
theory harmony chord-progressions key j-s-bach
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
New contributor
user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
For example, E Melodic Minor would have C#, allowing for a ii7-V-I cadence.
theory harmony chord-progressions key j-s-bach
theory harmony chord-progressions key j-s-bach
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
New contributor
user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
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asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
New contributor
user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
edited 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
32k671136
asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
New contributor
user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
asked 3 hours ago
user53092
102
102
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user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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New contributor
user53092 is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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3 Answers
3
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up vote
1
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Yes, all the time. Because Bach (although he was quite prepared to be 'modal' at times) set down the foundations of functional harmony, built on dominant-tonic resolutions. And if you want a perfect cadence in a minor key, you need a major dominant chord including the leading note. And, for smooth voice-leading, that implies a melodic minor scale.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
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Yes and no.
"Yes" because there are certainly moments where he uses the raised sixth and seventh scale degrees of a minor scale. In fact, a recent question discussed such an example: Functional analysis of chorale 'Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe' BWV 244/46
But it's also "no" because there really aren't "melodic minor keys." Minor is just minor, and the fact is that music (especially by someone like bach) rarely sticks to one "form" of minor. In practice, music in minor flows freely between the natural, harmonic, and minor forms of the minor scale. So it's a bit of a misnomer to ask whether Bach ever used a "melodic minor key"; instead, we simply acknowledge that music is in a minor key, and scale-degrees six and seven have a particular fluidity that allows them to be adjusted at various points.
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
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The raised 6ths and 7ths in minor are mostly used when the line is ascending toward the tonic. Bach used this very often. When the line is descending away from the tonic, the 6th and 7th degrees are often used as they would be in the natural minor. It is quite common to have both the natural and raised 6th and 7th degrees in the same phrase, depending on how the line flows. One line can easily go up and down in relation to the tonic within the same phrase, and the notes would be adjusted accordingly.
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
1
down vote
Yes, all the time. Because Bach (although he was quite prepared to be 'modal' at times) set down the foundations of functional harmony, built on dominant-tonic resolutions. And if you want a perfect cadence in a minor key, you need a major dominant chord including the leading note. And, for smooth voice-leading, that implies a melodic minor scale.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Yes, all the time. Because Bach (although he was quite prepared to be 'modal' at times) set down the foundations of functional harmony, built on dominant-tonic resolutions. And if you want a perfect cadence in a minor key, you need a major dominant chord including the leading note. And, for smooth voice-leading, that implies a melodic minor scale.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
Yes, all the time. Because Bach (although he was quite prepared to be 'modal' at times) set down the foundations of functional harmony, built on dominant-tonic resolutions. And if you want a perfect cadence in a minor key, you need a major dominant chord including the leading note. And, for smooth voice-leading, that implies a melodic minor scale.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
Yes, all the time. Because Bach (although he was quite prepared to be 'modal' at times) set down the foundations of functional harmony, built on dominant-tonic resolutions. And if you want a perfect cadence in a minor key, you need a major dominant chord including the leading note. And, for smooth voice-leading, that implies a melodic minor scale.
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
answered 3 hours ago
Laurence Payne
27.6k1350
27.6k1350
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
add a comment |Â
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
But how would Bach use both C and C# or D and D# for instance?
– user53092
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
Well, he probably wouldn't use them both in the same phrase!
– Laurence Payne
2 hours ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Yes and no.
"Yes" because there are certainly moments where he uses the raised sixth and seventh scale degrees of a minor scale. In fact, a recent question discussed such an example: Functional analysis of chorale 'Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe' BWV 244/46
But it's also "no" because there really aren't "melodic minor keys." Minor is just minor, and the fact is that music (especially by someone like bach) rarely sticks to one "form" of minor. In practice, music in minor flows freely between the natural, harmonic, and minor forms of the minor scale. So it's a bit of a misnomer to ask whether Bach ever used a "melodic minor key"; instead, we simply acknowledge that music is in a minor key, and scale-degrees six and seven have a particular fluidity that allows them to be adjusted at various points.
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Yes and no.
"Yes" because there are certainly moments where he uses the raised sixth and seventh scale degrees of a minor scale. In fact, a recent question discussed such an example: Functional analysis of chorale 'Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe' BWV 244/46
But it's also "no" because there really aren't "melodic minor keys." Minor is just minor, and the fact is that music (especially by someone like bach) rarely sticks to one "form" of minor. In practice, music in minor flows freely between the natural, harmonic, and minor forms of the minor scale. So it's a bit of a misnomer to ask whether Bach ever used a "melodic minor key"; instead, we simply acknowledge that music is in a minor key, and scale-degrees six and seven have a particular fluidity that allows them to be adjusted at various points.
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
Yes and no.
"Yes" because there are certainly moments where he uses the raised sixth and seventh scale degrees of a minor scale. In fact, a recent question discussed such an example: Functional analysis of chorale 'Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe' BWV 244/46
But it's also "no" because there really aren't "melodic minor keys." Minor is just minor, and the fact is that music (especially by someone like bach) rarely sticks to one "form" of minor. In practice, music in minor flows freely between the natural, harmonic, and minor forms of the minor scale. So it's a bit of a misnomer to ask whether Bach ever used a "melodic minor key"; instead, we simply acknowledge that music is in a minor key, and scale-degrees six and seven have a particular fluidity that allows them to be adjusted at various points.
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
Yes and no.
"Yes" because there are certainly moments where he uses the raised sixth and seventh scale degrees of a minor scale. In fact, a recent question discussed such an example: Functional analysis of chorale 'Wie wunderbarlich ist doch diese Strafe' BWV 244/46
But it's also "no" because there really aren't "melodic minor keys." Minor is just minor, and the fact is that music (especially by someone like bach) rarely sticks to one "form" of minor. In practice, music in minor flows freely between the natural, harmonic, and minor forms of the minor scale. So it's a bit of a misnomer to ask whether Bach ever used a "melodic minor key"; instead, we simply acknowledge that music is in a minor key, and scale-degrees six and seven have a particular fluidity that allows them to be adjusted at various points.
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
answered 2 hours ago
Richard
32k671136
32k671136
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
The raised 6ths and 7ths in minor are mostly used when the line is ascending toward the tonic. Bach used this very often. When the line is descending away from the tonic, the 6th and 7th degrees are often used as they would be in the natural minor. It is quite common to have both the natural and raised 6th and 7th degrees in the same phrase, depending on how the line flows. One line can easily go up and down in relation to the tonic within the same phrase, and the notes would be adjusted accordingly.
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
The raised 6ths and 7ths in minor are mostly used when the line is ascending toward the tonic. Bach used this very often. When the line is descending away from the tonic, the 6th and 7th degrees are often used as they would be in the natural minor. It is quite common to have both the natural and raised 6th and 7th degrees in the same phrase, depending on how the line flows. One line can easily go up and down in relation to the tonic within the same phrase, and the notes would be adjusted accordingly.
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
The raised 6ths and 7ths in minor are mostly used when the line is ascending toward the tonic. Bach used this very often. When the line is descending away from the tonic, the 6th and 7th degrees are often used as they would be in the natural minor. It is quite common to have both the natural and raised 6th and 7th degrees in the same phrase, depending on how the line flows. One line can easily go up and down in relation to the tonic within the same phrase, and the notes would be adjusted accordingly.
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
The raised 6ths and 7ths in minor are mostly used when the line is ascending toward the tonic. Bach used this very often. When the line is descending away from the tonic, the 6th and 7th degrees are often used as they would be in the natural minor. It is quite common to have both the natural and raised 6th and 7th degrees in the same phrase, depending on how the line flows. One line can easily go up and down in relation to the tonic within the same phrase, and the notes would be adjusted accordingly.
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
answered 1 hour ago
Heather S.
2,187215
2,187215
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
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