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Is it 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ or 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢?
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A Google search of both exact phrases turns up both:
- 在桌åÂÂ上é¢
- 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢
There are about 10x more without the 的.
Do they mean the same thing?
grammar usage
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
A Google search of both exact phrases turns up both:
- 在桌åÂÂ上é¢
- 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢
There are about 10x more without the 的.
Do they mean the same thing?
grammar usage
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
3
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
A Google search of both exact phrases turns up both:
- 在桌åÂÂ上é¢
- 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢
There are about 10x more without the 的.
Do they mean the same thing?
grammar usage
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
A Google search of both exact phrases turns up both:
- 在桌åÂÂ上é¢
- 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢
There are about 10x more without the 的.
Do they mean the same thing?
grammar usage
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
asked Aug 17 at 22:14
Ben Jackson
1475
1475
3
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31
add a comment |Â
3
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31
3
3
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31
add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
accepted
"的" is a possessive marker like ('s) in English.
"桌åÂÂ的" = (table's) e.g "桌åÂÂ的é¡Â色" (the color of the table), in which, the noun "桌åÂÂ" possess the noun "é¡Â色"
"在 ~ 上é¢" (on/ on top of/ above) is a preposition. The phrase "在(桌åÂÂ)上é¢" (noun + preposition), doesn't require the possessive marker "的" because there is no noun to be possessed.
"在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" (on the surface of the table) [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] 上é¢ here is a noun that means 'surface/ top'
"在桌åÂÂ上é¢" (on the table) [noun + preposition] 上é¢ here is a preposition means 'above'
"在桌åÂÂ上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
"在桌上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
Example of difference between with or without 的:
書(在)桌åÂÂ(上é¢) = the book is (on) the table
書在桌åÂÂ(的)上é¢ = the book is on the table('s) surface/top (noun)
In the first sentence, "在 ~ 上é¢"(on top of) is the preposition; in the second sentence, "在" (on/ at) is the only preposition, while "上é¢" is a noun that the noun "桌åÂÂ" possessed
Usage of 的 as an 'adjective marker'
"桌åÂÂ上的書" (the book on the table)
"桌åÂÂ上"(on the table) is a noun + preposition
的 here functions as an 'adjective marker' that turns "桌åÂÂ上" into an 'adjectival phrase': "桌åÂÂ上的" which describes the noun "書" (the book that's on the table)
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Both 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢ and 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ denote the same meaning. The difference between them is the former is verbose.
In Chinese writing and speaking, in order to be succinct, we try to avoid to use more 的s, especially in a long sentence. So, people tend to drop it whenever they feel it's not necessary. That's why you have seen 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is much more than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
accepted
"的" is a possessive marker like ('s) in English.
"桌åÂÂ的" = (table's) e.g "桌åÂÂ的é¡Â色" (the color of the table), in which, the noun "桌åÂÂ" possess the noun "é¡Â色"
"在 ~ 上é¢" (on/ on top of/ above) is a preposition. The phrase "在(桌åÂÂ)上é¢" (noun + preposition), doesn't require the possessive marker "的" because there is no noun to be possessed.
"在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" (on the surface of the table) [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] 上é¢ here is a noun that means 'surface/ top'
"在桌åÂÂ上é¢" (on the table) [noun + preposition] 上é¢ here is a preposition means 'above'
"在桌åÂÂ上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
"在桌上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
Example of difference between with or without 的:
書(在)桌åÂÂ(上é¢) = the book is (on) the table
書在桌åÂÂ(的)上é¢ = the book is on the table('s) surface/top (noun)
In the first sentence, "在 ~ 上é¢"(on top of) is the preposition; in the second sentence, "在" (on/ at) is the only preposition, while "上é¢" is a noun that the noun "桌åÂÂ" possessed
Usage of 的 as an 'adjective marker'
"桌åÂÂ上的書" (the book on the table)
"桌åÂÂ上"(on the table) is a noun + preposition
的 here functions as an 'adjective marker' that turns "桌åÂÂ上" into an 'adjectival phrase': "桌åÂÂ上的" which describes the noun "書" (the book that's on the table)
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
accepted
"的" is a possessive marker like ('s) in English.
"桌åÂÂ的" = (table's) e.g "桌åÂÂ的é¡Â色" (the color of the table), in which, the noun "桌åÂÂ" possess the noun "é¡Â色"
"在 ~ 上é¢" (on/ on top of/ above) is a preposition. The phrase "在(桌åÂÂ)上é¢" (noun + preposition), doesn't require the possessive marker "的" because there is no noun to be possessed.
"在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" (on the surface of the table) [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] 上é¢ here is a noun that means 'surface/ top'
"在桌åÂÂ上é¢" (on the table) [noun + preposition] 上é¢ here is a preposition means 'above'
"在桌åÂÂ上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
"在桌上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
Example of difference between with or without 的:
書(在)桌åÂÂ(上é¢) = the book is (on) the table
書在桌åÂÂ(的)上é¢ = the book is on the table('s) surface/top (noun)
In the first sentence, "在 ~ 上é¢"(on top of) is the preposition; in the second sentence, "在" (on/ at) is the only preposition, while "上é¢" is a noun that the noun "桌åÂÂ" possessed
Usage of 的 as an 'adjective marker'
"桌åÂÂ上的書" (the book on the table)
"桌åÂÂ上"(on the table) is a noun + preposition
的 here functions as an 'adjective marker' that turns "桌åÂÂ上" into an 'adjectival phrase': "桌åÂÂ上的" which describes the noun "書" (the book that's on the table)
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
accepted
up vote
4
down vote
accepted
"的" is a possessive marker like ('s) in English.
"桌åÂÂ的" = (table's) e.g "桌åÂÂ的é¡Â色" (the color of the table), in which, the noun "桌åÂÂ" possess the noun "é¡Â色"
"在 ~ 上é¢" (on/ on top of/ above) is a preposition. The phrase "在(桌åÂÂ)上é¢" (noun + preposition), doesn't require the possessive marker "的" because there is no noun to be possessed.
"在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" (on the surface of the table) [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] 上é¢ here is a noun that means 'surface/ top'
"在桌åÂÂ上é¢" (on the table) [noun + preposition] 上é¢ here is a preposition means 'above'
"在桌åÂÂ上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
"在桌上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
Example of difference between with or without 的:
書(在)桌åÂÂ(上é¢) = the book is (on) the table
書在桌åÂÂ(的)上é¢ = the book is on the table('s) surface/top (noun)
In the first sentence, "在 ~ 上é¢"(on top of) is the preposition; in the second sentence, "在" (on/ at) is the only preposition, while "上é¢" is a noun that the noun "桌åÂÂ" possessed
Usage of 的 as an 'adjective marker'
"桌åÂÂ上的書" (the book on the table)
"桌åÂÂ上"(on the table) is a noun + preposition
的 here functions as an 'adjective marker' that turns "桌åÂÂ上" into an 'adjectival phrase': "桌åÂÂ上的" which describes the noun "書" (the book that's on the table)
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
"的" is a possessive marker like ('s) in English.
"桌åÂÂ的" = (table's) e.g "桌åÂÂ的é¡Â色" (the color of the table), in which, the noun "桌åÂÂ" possess the noun "é¡Â色"
"在 ~ 上é¢" (on/ on top of/ above) is a preposition. The phrase "在(桌åÂÂ)上é¢" (noun + preposition), doesn't require the possessive marker "的" because there is no noun to be possessed.
"在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" (on the surface of the table) [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] 上é¢ here is a noun that means 'surface/ top'
"在桌åÂÂ上é¢" (on the table) [noun + preposition] 上é¢ here is a preposition means 'above'
"在桌åÂÂ上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
"在桌上" (on the table) [ noun + preposition]
Example of difference between with or without 的:
書(在)桌åÂÂ(上é¢) = the book is (on) the table
書在桌åÂÂ(的)上é¢ = the book is on the table('s) surface/top (noun)
In the first sentence, "在 ~ 上é¢"(on top of) is the preposition; in the second sentence, "在" (on/ at) is the only preposition, while "上é¢" is a noun that the noun "桌åÂÂ" possessed
Usage of 的 as an 'adjective marker'
"桌åÂÂ上的書" (the book on the table)
"桌åÂÂ上"(on the table) is a noun + preposition
的 here functions as an 'adjective marker' that turns "桌åÂÂ上" into an 'adjectival phrase': "桌åÂÂ上的" which describes the noun "書" (the book that's on the table)
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
edited Aug 17 at 23:25
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
answered Aug 17 at 22:57
Tang Ho
23k1437
23k1437
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
add a comment |Â
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
Thanks for the explanation of the construction without 的. This matches other grammar resources. However, examples of the construction with 的 exist, which I would also like to understand.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 17 at 23:00
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
@Ben Jackson please see my edition
– Tang Ho
Aug 17 at 23:06
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Both 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢ and 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ denote the same meaning. The difference between them is the former is verbose.
In Chinese writing and speaking, in order to be succinct, we try to avoid to use more 的s, especially in a long sentence. So, people tend to drop it whenever they feel it's not necessary. That's why you have seen 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is much more than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Both 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢ and 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ denote the same meaning. The difference between them is the former is verbose.
In Chinese writing and speaking, in order to be succinct, we try to avoid to use more 的s, especially in a long sentence. So, people tend to drop it whenever they feel it's not necessary. That's why you have seen 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is much more than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Both 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢ and 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ denote the same meaning. The difference between them is the former is verbose.
In Chinese writing and speaking, in order to be succinct, we try to avoid to use more 的s, especially in a long sentence. So, people tend to drop it whenever they feel it's not necessary. That's why you have seen 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is much more than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
Both 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢ and 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ denote the same meaning. The difference between them is the former is verbose.
In Chinese writing and speaking, in order to be succinct, we try to avoid to use more 的s, especially in a long sentence. So, people tend to drop it whenever they feel it's not necessary. That's why you have seen 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is much more than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
answered Aug 18 at 0:11
dan
9,4551314
9,4551314
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
add a comment |Â
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
The 的 structure is not completely useless, for example: "在桌åÂÂ(的)左上角" (upper left corner- a noun) is more clear than "在桌åÂÂ左上角", it emphasize the exact location 左上角 instead of 桌å itself
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 1:54
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo but 在桌åÂÂ上é¢ is far more common than 在桌åÂÂ的上é¢.
– dan
Aug 18 at 3:20
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
@TangHo for example, 我的包在我家的桌åÂÂ的上é¢; we usually put sentence like: 我包在我家桌åÂÂ上.
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:06
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
I do not disagree the [noun + preposition] structure "在桌åÂÂ上" is more common and cleaner than the [preposition + noun + possessive marker + noun] structure "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢" . Which only serves to emphasize the exact location "上é¢" (the surface)
– Tang Ho
Aug 18 at 4:13
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
@TangHo ok, but for the emphasis purpose, we just stress the word 桌å in spoken, instead of adding a 的 most of time. For example, 我包在桌åÂÂ上ï¼Âä¸Â在椅åÂÂ上ï¼Â
– dan
Aug 18 at 4:20
add a comment |Â
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3
In a daily conversation scenario they do meaning the same thing. The accepted answer pointed out that the latter one emphases "being on the surface of the table", but in daily conversations actually, nobody would really pay attention to such subtlety, and would take both for the same meaning "being on the table".
– Vim
Aug 18 at 5:07
meaning of "both exact phrases turns up both" obscure, as users understand the two phrases are searched, then the search result is again both?
– user6065
Aug 18 at 9:51
@user6065 If you search for a "quoted string" on Google you will only get results for that exact string. So I used that to count how many times each phrase was found. A Google search of (both exact phrases => "在桌åÂÂ上é¢" and "在桌åÂÂ的上é¢") turns up (gives results for) both.
– Ben Jackson
Aug 18 at 15:47
第二个强调上é¢，比如，有个人，the man can be on it or in it's painting.
– Daniel Yeung
Aug 19 at 0:31