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The DUP have threatened to “vote down the budget†- but what does this mean?
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The DUP have threatened to “vote down the budget†if their requirements for Brexit are not met.
But what does this mean in practice? Will the Government have trouble passing a budget in this event?
united-kingdom budget
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Ben
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up vote
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The DUP have threatened to “vote down the budget†if their requirements for Brexit are not met.
But what does this mean in practice? Will the Government have trouble passing a budget in this event?
united-kingdom budget
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
add a comment |Â
up vote
4
down vote
favorite
up vote
4
down vote
favorite
The DUP have threatened to “vote down the budget†if their requirements for Brexit are not met.
But what does this mean in practice? Will the Government have trouble passing a budget in this event?
united-kingdom budget
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
The DUP have threatened to “vote down the budget†if their requirements for Brexit are not met.
But what does this mean in practice? Will the Government have trouble passing a budget in this event?
united-kingdom budget
united-kingdom budget
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
asked 1 hour ago
Ben
1,069414
1,069414
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
The convention in the UK House of Commons is that the budget vote also works as a confidence vote in the government. So losing a vote on the budget is taken as a vote of no confidence in the government (as is the vote on the Queen's Speech). The last time the government lost a budget vote was in 1885, when Gladstone's government lost 252-264 and the government resigned the following day.
Much of UK politics is governed by convention rather than law. The convention was that after losing a confidence vote the government had to call a general election. But there was no law requiring them to do so.
This changed in 2011 with the fixed term parliament act which legally requires the government to win a confidence vote within 14 days or be forced to call a general election, which creates a get-out clause that wasn't there before: the DUP could first vote against the budget and later vote for the government in a second confidence motion. Before 2011, the budget vote itself would trigger a general election.
But this is uncharted territory as to whether the government could hang on for a second confidence vote, or what the DUP would actually do.
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
The budget is the annual finance act of parliament. The government needs to raise money by tax and the budget gives the government parliamentary approval for this. Without a budget being passed the government cannot function.
Normally a government party either has a majority in the House of Commons, or is in a coalition with another party which gives it a majority. These parties then instruct their MPs to vote for the Budget, which allows the government to operate.
However, the current government does not have a majority. It depends on an agreement with the DUP. Previously the DUP has agreed to vote with the government on "Finance and Confidence" motions. Thus the government is able to proceed with its business. The DUP are threatening to break this agreement if the "deal" with the EU breaks their "red lines". Roughly these are that exactly the same customs arrangements that apply to the UK should also apply to Northern Ireland.
There are currently 316 Conservative MPs, and 315 MPs in opposition parties (excluding the DUP, and Sinn Fein who do not vote in the UK parliament) that are likely to vote against the government in a budget vote. Given the partisan nature of the Commons, it is unlikely for opposition MPs to vote with the Government on a finance bill. Thus the position of the DUP is critical. If the DUP vote for the bill it will pass, and if they vote against it will fail.
If the budget is not passed, then the government cannot function, and a confidence vote is almost certain to follow. If the budget is not passed but government nevertheless pass a confidence vote, we are in uncharted territory. The EU may decide to change the agreement, or it may result in UK leaving with no agreed deal on the future relationship.
If the government doesn't pass a confidence vote then the likelihood is new elections. The result of those elections would determine what would happen next.
This may all be sabre rattling. Robert Peston thinks that the deal that officials have negotiated is likely to be acceptable to the DUP, but they just want to remind the PM that they can't be taken for granted.
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Just to add some context to the other answers, the current Conservative government lost its majority at the last election. In other words it doesn't have more MPs than the rest of the parties combined, so if all other parties vote against the budget it won't pass.
This is a dire situation and makes it extremely difficult to govern, so the Tories did a deal with the DUP. In exchange for £1.5 billion of extra spending in Northern Ireland and an effective veto over the government's Brexit policy the DUP agreed to support the Tories by voting with them, giving the two combined a majority. It's a kind of informal coalition but without a strong or legally binding agreement.
As such the DUP can choose to walk away at any time. Although that would presumably cancel any of the £1.5 billion not already spent in Northern Ireland, as it was effectively a bribe, it would also allow them to block an Brexit deal that they don't like.
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
add a comment |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
The convention in the UK House of Commons is that the budget vote also works as a confidence vote in the government. So losing a vote on the budget is taken as a vote of no confidence in the government (as is the vote on the Queen's Speech). The last time the government lost a budget vote was in 1885, when Gladstone's government lost 252-264 and the government resigned the following day.
Much of UK politics is governed by convention rather than law. The convention was that after losing a confidence vote the government had to call a general election. But there was no law requiring them to do so.
This changed in 2011 with the fixed term parliament act which legally requires the government to win a confidence vote within 14 days or be forced to call a general election, which creates a get-out clause that wasn't there before: the DUP could first vote against the budget and later vote for the government in a second confidence motion. Before 2011, the budget vote itself would trigger a general election.
But this is uncharted territory as to whether the government could hang on for a second confidence vote, or what the DUP would actually do.
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
The convention in the UK House of Commons is that the budget vote also works as a confidence vote in the government. So losing a vote on the budget is taken as a vote of no confidence in the government (as is the vote on the Queen's Speech). The last time the government lost a budget vote was in 1885, when Gladstone's government lost 252-264 and the government resigned the following day.
Much of UK politics is governed by convention rather than law. The convention was that after losing a confidence vote the government had to call a general election. But there was no law requiring them to do so.
This changed in 2011 with the fixed term parliament act which legally requires the government to win a confidence vote within 14 days or be forced to call a general election, which creates a get-out clause that wasn't there before: the DUP could first vote against the budget and later vote for the government in a second confidence motion. Before 2011, the budget vote itself would trigger a general election.
But this is uncharted territory as to whether the government could hang on for a second confidence vote, or what the DUP would actually do.
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
The convention in the UK House of Commons is that the budget vote also works as a confidence vote in the government. So losing a vote on the budget is taken as a vote of no confidence in the government (as is the vote on the Queen's Speech). The last time the government lost a budget vote was in 1885, when Gladstone's government lost 252-264 and the government resigned the following day.
Much of UK politics is governed by convention rather than law. The convention was that after losing a confidence vote the government had to call a general election. But there was no law requiring them to do so.
This changed in 2011 with the fixed term parliament act which legally requires the government to win a confidence vote within 14 days or be forced to call a general election, which creates a get-out clause that wasn't there before: the DUP could first vote against the budget and later vote for the government in a second confidence motion. Before 2011, the budget vote itself would trigger a general election.
But this is uncharted territory as to whether the government could hang on for a second confidence vote, or what the DUP would actually do.
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
The convention in the UK House of Commons is that the budget vote also works as a confidence vote in the government. So losing a vote on the budget is taken as a vote of no confidence in the government (as is the vote on the Queen's Speech). The last time the government lost a budget vote was in 1885, when Gladstone's government lost 252-264 and the government resigned the following day.
Much of UK politics is governed by convention rather than law. The convention was that after losing a confidence vote the government had to call a general election. But there was no law requiring them to do so.
This changed in 2011 with the fixed term parliament act which legally requires the government to win a confidence vote within 14 days or be forced to call a general election, which creates a get-out clause that wasn't there before: the DUP could first vote against the budget and later vote for the government in a second confidence motion. Before 2011, the budget vote itself would trigger a general election.
But this is uncharted territory as to whether the government could hang on for a second confidence vote, or what the DUP would actually do.
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
edited 20 mins ago
RedGrittyBrick
3,5041720
3,5041720
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
answered 34 mins ago
PhillS
1,6202414
1,6202414
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
The budget is the annual finance act of parliament. The government needs to raise money by tax and the budget gives the government parliamentary approval for this. Without a budget being passed the government cannot function.
Normally a government party either has a majority in the House of Commons, or is in a coalition with another party which gives it a majority. These parties then instruct their MPs to vote for the Budget, which allows the government to operate.
However, the current government does not have a majority. It depends on an agreement with the DUP. Previously the DUP has agreed to vote with the government on "Finance and Confidence" motions. Thus the government is able to proceed with its business. The DUP are threatening to break this agreement if the "deal" with the EU breaks their "red lines". Roughly these are that exactly the same customs arrangements that apply to the UK should also apply to Northern Ireland.
There are currently 316 Conservative MPs, and 315 MPs in opposition parties (excluding the DUP, and Sinn Fein who do not vote in the UK parliament) that are likely to vote against the government in a budget vote. Given the partisan nature of the Commons, it is unlikely for opposition MPs to vote with the Government on a finance bill. Thus the position of the DUP is critical. If the DUP vote for the bill it will pass, and if they vote against it will fail.
If the budget is not passed, then the government cannot function, and a confidence vote is almost certain to follow. If the budget is not passed but government nevertheless pass a confidence vote, we are in uncharted territory. The EU may decide to change the agreement, or it may result in UK leaving with no agreed deal on the future relationship.
If the government doesn't pass a confidence vote then the likelihood is new elections. The result of those elections would determine what would happen next.
This may all be sabre rattling. Robert Peston thinks that the deal that officials have negotiated is likely to be acceptable to the DUP, but they just want to remind the PM that they can't be taken for granted.
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
The budget is the annual finance act of parliament. The government needs to raise money by tax and the budget gives the government parliamentary approval for this. Without a budget being passed the government cannot function.
Normally a government party either has a majority in the House of Commons, or is in a coalition with another party which gives it a majority. These parties then instruct their MPs to vote for the Budget, which allows the government to operate.
However, the current government does not have a majority. It depends on an agreement with the DUP. Previously the DUP has agreed to vote with the government on "Finance and Confidence" motions. Thus the government is able to proceed with its business. The DUP are threatening to break this agreement if the "deal" with the EU breaks their "red lines". Roughly these are that exactly the same customs arrangements that apply to the UK should also apply to Northern Ireland.
There are currently 316 Conservative MPs, and 315 MPs in opposition parties (excluding the DUP, and Sinn Fein who do not vote in the UK parliament) that are likely to vote against the government in a budget vote. Given the partisan nature of the Commons, it is unlikely for opposition MPs to vote with the Government on a finance bill. Thus the position of the DUP is critical. If the DUP vote for the bill it will pass, and if they vote against it will fail.
If the budget is not passed, then the government cannot function, and a confidence vote is almost certain to follow. If the budget is not passed but government nevertheless pass a confidence vote, we are in uncharted territory. The EU may decide to change the agreement, or it may result in UK leaving with no agreed deal on the future relationship.
If the government doesn't pass a confidence vote then the likelihood is new elections. The result of those elections would determine what would happen next.
This may all be sabre rattling. Robert Peston thinks that the deal that officials have negotiated is likely to be acceptable to the DUP, but they just want to remind the PM that they can't be taken for granted.
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
The budget is the annual finance act of parliament. The government needs to raise money by tax and the budget gives the government parliamentary approval for this. Without a budget being passed the government cannot function.
Normally a government party either has a majority in the House of Commons, or is in a coalition with another party which gives it a majority. These parties then instruct their MPs to vote for the Budget, which allows the government to operate.
However, the current government does not have a majority. It depends on an agreement with the DUP. Previously the DUP has agreed to vote with the government on "Finance and Confidence" motions. Thus the government is able to proceed with its business. The DUP are threatening to break this agreement if the "deal" with the EU breaks their "red lines". Roughly these are that exactly the same customs arrangements that apply to the UK should also apply to Northern Ireland.
There are currently 316 Conservative MPs, and 315 MPs in opposition parties (excluding the DUP, and Sinn Fein who do not vote in the UK parliament) that are likely to vote against the government in a budget vote. Given the partisan nature of the Commons, it is unlikely for opposition MPs to vote with the Government on a finance bill. Thus the position of the DUP is critical. If the DUP vote for the bill it will pass, and if they vote against it will fail.
If the budget is not passed, then the government cannot function, and a confidence vote is almost certain to follow. If the budget is not passed but government nevertheless pass a confidence vote, we are in uncharted territory. The EU may decide to change the agreement, or it may result in UK leaving with no agreed deal on the future relationship.
If the government doesn't pass a confidence vote then the likelihood is new elections. The result of those elections would determine what would happen next.
This may all be sabre rattling. Robert Peston thinks that the deal that officials have negotiated is likely to be acceptable to the DUP, but they just want to remind the PM that they can't be taken for granted.
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
The budget is the annual finance act of parliament. The government needs to raise money by tax and the budget gives the government parliamentary approval for this. Without a budget being passed the government cannot function.
Normally a government party either has a majority in the House of Commons, or is in a coalition with another party which gives it a majority. These parties then instruct their MPs to vote for the Budget, which allows the government to operate.
However, the current government does not have a majority. It depends on an agreement with the DUP. Previously the DUP has agreed to vote with the government on "Finance and Confidence" motions. Thus the government is able to proceed with its business. The DUP are threatening to break this agreement if the "deal" with the EU breaks their "red lines". Roughly these are that exactly the same customs arrangements that apply to the UK should also apply to Northern Ireland.
There are currently 316 Conservative MPs, and 315 MPs in opposition parties (excluding the DUP, and Sinn Fein who do not vote in the UK parliament) that are likely to vote against the government in a budget vote. Given the partisan nature of the Commons, it is unlikely for opposition MPs to vote with the Government on a finance bill. Thus the position of the DUP is critical. If the DUP vote for the bill it will pass, and if they vote against it will fail.
If the budget is not passed, then the government cannot function, and a confidence vote is almost certain to follow. If the budget is not passed but government nevertheless pass a confidence vote, we are in uncharted territory. The EU may decide to change the agreement, or it may result in UK leaving with no agreed deal on the future relationship.
If the government doesn't pass a confidence vote then the likelihood is new elections. The result of those elections would determine what would happen next.
This may all be sabre rattling. Robert Peston thinks that the deal that officials have negotiated is likely to be acceptable to the DUP, but they just want to remind the PM that they can't be taken for granted.
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
edited 5 mins ago
user
4,72621125
4,72621125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
answered 35 mins ago
James K
29.6k889125
29.6k889125
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
add a comment |Â
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
Do you mean 316 Tory MPs and 315 opposition excluding the DUP?
– user
12 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
315 excluding the DUP and Sinn Fein (who do not vote)
– James K
11 mins ago
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Just to add some context to the other answers, the current Conservative government lost its majority at the last election. In other words it doesn't have more MPs than the rest of the parties combined, so if all other parties vote against the budget it won't pass.
This is a dire situation and makes it extremely difficult to govern, so the Tories did a deal with the DUP. In exchange for £1.5 billion of extra spending in Northern Ireland and an effective veto over the government's Brexit policy the DUP agreed to support the Tories by voting with them, giving the two combined a majority. It's a kind of informal coalition but without a strong or legally binding agreement.
As such the DUP can choose to walk away at any time. Although that would presumably cancel any of the £1.5 billion not already spent in Northern Ireland, as it was effectively a bribe, it would also allow them to block an Brexit deal that they don't like.
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Just to add some context to the other answers, the current Conservative government lost its majority at the last election. In other words it doesn't have more MPs than the rest of the parties combined, so if all other parties vote against the budget it won't pass.
This is a dire situation and makes it extremely difficult to govern, so the Tories did a deal with the DUP. In exchange for £1.5 billion of extra spending in Northern Ireland and an effective veto over the government's Brexit policy the DUP agreed to support the Tories by voting with them, giving the two combined a majority. It's a kind of informal coalition but without a strong or legally binding agreement.
As such the DUP can choose to walk away at any time. Although that would presumably cancel any of the £1.5 billion not already spent in Northern Ireland, as it was effectively a bribe, it would also allow them to block an Brexit deal that they don't like.
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Just to add some context to the other answers, the current Conservative government lost its majority at the last election. In other words it doesn't have more MPs than the rest of the parties combined, so if all other parties vote against the budget it won't pass.
This is a dire situation and makes it extremely difficult to govern, so the Tories did a deal with the DUP. In exchange for £1.5 billion of extra spending in Northern Ireland and an effective veto over the government's Brexit policy the DUP agreed to support the Tories by voting with them, giving the two combined a majority. It's a kind of informal coalition but without a strong or legally binding agreement.
As such the DUP can choose to walk away at any time. Although that would presumably cancel any of the £1.5 billion not already spent in Northern Ireland, as it was effectively a bribe, it would also allow them to block an Brexit deal that they don't like.
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
Just to add some context to the other answers, the current Conservative government lost its majority at the last election. In other words it doesn't have more MPs than the rest of the parties combined, so if all other parties vote against the budget it won't pass.
This is a dire situation and makes it extremely difficult to govern, so the Tories did a deal with the DUP. In exchange for £1.5 billion of extra spending in Northern Ireland and an effective veto over the government's Brexit policy the DUP agreed to support the Tories by voting with them, giving the two combined a majority. It's a kind of informal coalition but without a strong or legally binding agreement.
As such the DUP can choose to walk away at any time. Although that would presumably cancel any of the £1.5 billion not already spent in Northern Ireland, as it was effectively a bribe, it would also allow them to block an Brexit deal that they don't like.
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
answered 7 mins ago
user
4,72621125
4,72621125
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
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