Questioning Employer's tactic to collect a debt equaling value of unearned personal time off [closed]
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The certified letter states, "this is a legal attempt to collect a debt" I hadn't known of.
My employer advances the full amount of Vacation, sick and personal time at the beginning of each year, though it accrues as we work over the course of the year. I resigned and applied to retire due to health problems with one month left in the year. I am in New Jersey, and a public employee.
My research shows employers do deduct the unearned time taken from a final paycheck. This did not happen. I understood how our paid time off worked, but I do not recall any written policy explaining that any "over utilization " of paid time off would have to be re-paid. There is nothing in my union contract to address this either.
Even if legit, it seems extreme to send a certified letter; when I researched the topic, I found nothing to address this practice or to confirm this is normal...Had I known I might have done differently; but I also left due to health problems and was hospitalized in for a week in Dec...had I known I could have planned delayed resigning until 2016 to stayed 1 more month and requested FMLA once in hospital.
Shouldn't it be reasonable on their part to work out a reasonable arrangement with me to re-pay. I do not want to explain all background (pursued ADA accommodation), but I have reason to believe this is a bullying tactic.
This is after all, 1/12 of my time.
resignation united-states vacation sickness legal
closed as off-topic by Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal♦ Jan 7 '16 at 11:43
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal
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The certified letter states, "this is a legal attempt to collect a debt" I hadn't known of.
My employer advances the full amount of Vacation, sick and personal time at the beginning of each year, though it accrues as we work over the course of the year. I resigned and applied to retire due to health problems with one month left in the year. I am in New Jersey, and a public employee.
My research shows employers do deduct the unearned time taken from a final paycheck. This did not happen. I understood how our paid time off worked, but I do not recall any written policy explaining that any "over utilization " of paid time off would have to be re-paid. There is nothing in my union contract to address this either.
Even if legit, it seems extreme to send a certified letter; when I researched the topic, I found nothing to address this practice or to confirm this is normal...Had I known I might have done differently; but I also left due to health problems and was hospitalized in for a week in Dec...had I known I could have planned delayed resigning until 2016 to stayed 1 more month and requested FMLA once in hospital.
Shouldn't it be reasonable on their part to work out a reasonable arrangement with me to re-pay. I do not want to explain all background (pursued ADA accommodation), but I have reason to believe this is a bullying tactic.
This is after all, 1/12 of my time.
resignation united-states vacation sickness legal
closed as off-topic by Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal♦ Jan 7 '16 at 11:43
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal
4
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
10
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
4
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
1
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
2
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15
 |Â
show 8 more comments
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
up vote
0
down vote
favorite
The certified letter states, "this is a legal attempt to collect a debt" I hadn't known of.
My employer advances the full amount of Vacation, sick and personal time at the beginning of each year, though it accrues as we work over the course of the year. I resigned and applied to retire due to health problems with one month left in the year. I am in New Jersey, and a public employee.
My research shows employers do deduct the unearned time taken from a final paycheck. This did not happen. I understood how our paid time off worked, but I do not recall any written policy explaining that any "over utilization " of paid time off would have to be re-paid. There is nothing in my union contract to address this either.
Even if legit, it seems extreme to send a certified letter; when I researched the topic, I found nothing to address this practice or to confirm this is normal...Had I known I might have done differently; but I also left due to health problems and was hospitalized in for a week in Dec...had I known I could have planned delayed resigning until 2016 to stayed 1 more month and requested FMLA once in hospital.
Shouldn't it be reasonable on their part to work out a reasonable arrangement with me to re-pay. I do not want to explain all background (pursued ADA accommodation), but I have reason to believe this is a bullying tactic.
This is after all, 1/12 of my time.
resignation united-states vacation sickness legal
The certified letter states, "this is a legal attempt to collect a debt" I hadn't known of.
My employer advances the full amount of Vacation, sick and personal time at the beginning of each year, though it accrues as we work over the course of the year. I resigned and applied to retire due to health problems with one month left in the year. I am in New Jersey, and a public employee.
My research shows employers do deduct the unearned time taken from a final paycheck. This did not happen. I understood how our paid time off worked, but I do not recall any written policy explaining that any "over utilization " of paid time off would have to be re-paid. There is nothing in my union contract to address this either.
Even if legit, it seems extreme to send a certified letter; when I researched the topic, I found nothing to address this practice or to confirm this is normal...Had I known I might have done differently; but I also left due to health problems and was hospitalized in for a week in Dec...had I known I could have planned delayed resigning until 2016 to stayed 1 more month and requested FMLA once in hospital.
Shouldn't it be reasonable on their part to work out a reasonable arrangement with me to re-pay. I do not want to explain all background (pursued ADA accommodation), but I have reason to believe this is a bullying tactic.
This is after all, 1/12 of my time.
resignation united-states vacation sickness legal
edited Jan 7 '16 at 19:29
user45576
32
32
asked Jan 7 '16 at 9:45
user45576
101
101
closed as off-topic by Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal♦ Jan 7 '16 at 11:43
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal
closed as off-topic by Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal♦ Jan 7 '16 at 11:43
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – Stephan Kolassa, Kent A., nvoigt, gnat, Lilienthal
4
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
10
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
4
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
1
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
2
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15
 |Â
show 8 more comments
4
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
10
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
4
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
1
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
2
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15
4
4
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
10
10
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
4
4
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
1
1
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
2
2
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15
 |Â
show 8 more comments
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
up vote
6
down vote
Let lawyers talk to lawyers.
When you receive a letter from an attorney, it's time to hire your own and let them tell you if and how to respond. Depending on where in the world you work and what the exact language of your contract is, your employer might or might not be entitled to the money. But we can't tell you because we know neither, and even when we would, we aren't lawyers, so you shouldn't trust our legal advise.
In general it is a bad idea for you as a layperson to do any communication with a lawyer you haven't hired. It's just too easy to make a mistake which could then be used against you. So it's time to get your own lawyer. Depending on where you live, a first-time consultation might be free, but as soon as the lawyer has to write a response, they will have to bill you.
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
2
down vote
There are two possibilities: Someone at the company honestly but incorrectly believes that you owe them the money, or someone at the company is doing this to annoy and to bully you. We don't know. You are a better judge about that company, so you may make a guess.
If you believe that an honest mistake was made then you should write them a letter telling them that you are not aware that you owe them any money, and to ask them why they believe that you owe them anything, so that any misunderstandings can be cleared up and fixed. Some records somewhere are likely incorrect and can be fixed. If you don't react, the person making the honest mistake will likely take further steps.
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
suggest improvements |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
6
down vote
Let lawyers talk to lawyers.
When you receive a letter from an attorney, it's time to hire your own and let them tell you if and how to respond. Depending on where in the world you work and what the exact language of your contract is, your employer might or might not be entitled to the money. But we can't tell you because we know neither, and even when we would, we aren't lawyers, so you shouldn't trust our legal advise.
In general it is a bad idea for you as a layperson to do any communication with a lawyer you haven't hired. It's just too easy to make a mistake which could then be used against you. So it's time to get your own lawyer. Depending on where you live, a first-time consultation might be free, but as soon as the lawyer has to write a response, they will have to bill you.
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
6
down vote
Let lawyers talk to lawyers.
When you receive a letter from an attorney, it's time to hire your own and let them tell you if and how to respond. Depending on where in the world you work and what the exact language of your contract is, your employer might or might not be entitled to the money. But we can't tell you because we know neither, and even when we would, we aren't lawyers, so you shouldn't trust our legal advise.
In general it is a bad idea for you as a layperson to do any communication with a lawyer you haven't hired. It's just too easy to make a mistake which could then be used against you. So it's time to get your own lawyer. Depending on where you live, a first-time consultation might be free, but as soon as the lawyer has to write a response, they will have to bill you.
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
6
down vote
up vote
6
down vote
Let lawyers talk to lawyers.
When you receive a letter from an attorney, it's time to hire your own and let them tell you if and how to respond. Depending on where in the world you work and what the exact language of your contract is, your employer might or might not be entitled to the money. But we can't tell you because we know neither, and even when we would, we aren't lawyers, so you shouldn't trust our legal advise.
In general it is a bad idea for you as a layperson to do any communication with a lawyer you haven't hired. It's just too easy to make a mistake which could then be used against you. So it's time to get your own lawyer. Depending on where you live, a first-time consultation might be free, but as soon as the lawyer has to write a response, they will have to bill you.
Let lawyers talk to lawyers.
When you receive a letter from an attorney, it's time to hire your own and let them tell you if and how to respond. Depending on where in the world you work and what the exact language of your contract is, your employer might or might not be entitled to the money. But we can't tell you because we know neither, and even when we would, we aren't lawyers, so you shouldn't trust our legal advise.
In general it is a bad idea for you as a layperson to do any communication with a lawyer you haven't hired. It's just too easy to make a mistake which could then be used against you. So it's time to get your own lawyer. Depending on where you live, a first-time consultation might be free, but as soon as the lawyer has to write a response, they will have to bill you.
edited Jan 7 '16 at 11:45
answered Jan 7 '16 at 11:40
Philipp
20.3k34884
20.3k34884
suggest improvements |Â
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
2
down vote
There are two possibilities: Someone at the company honestly but incorrectly believes that you owe them the money, or someone at the company is doing this to annoy and to bully you. We don't know. You are a better judge about that company, so you may make a guess.
If you believe that an honest mistake was made then you should write them a letter telling them that you are not aware that you owe them any money, and to ask them why they believe that you owe them anything, so that any misunderstandings can be cleared up and fixed. Some records somewhere are likely incorrect and can be fixed. If you don't react, the person making the honest mistake will likely take further steps.
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
2
down vote
There are two possibilities: Someone at the company honestly but incorrectly believes that you owe them the money, or someone at the company is doing this to annoy and to bully you. We don't know. You are a better judge about that company, so you may make a guess.
If you believe that an honest mistake was made then you should write them a letter telling them that you are not aware that you owe them any money, and to ask them why they believe that you owe them anything, so that any misunderstandings can be cleared up and fixed. Some records somewhere are likely incorrect and can be fixed. If you don't react, the person making the honest mistake will likely take further steps.
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
There are two possibilities: Someone at the company honestly but incorrectly believes that you owe them the money, or someone at the company is doing this to annoy and to bully you. We don't know. You are a better judge about that company, so you may make a guess.
If you believe that an honest mistake was made then you should write them a letter telling them that you are not aware that you owe them any money, and to ask them why they believe that you owe them anything, so that any misunderstandings can be cleared up and fixed. Some records somewhere are likely incorrect and can be fixed. If you don't react, the person making the honest mistake will likely take further steps.
There are two possibilities: Someone at the company honestly but incorrectly believes that you owe them the money, or someone at the company is doing this to annoy and to bully you. We don't know. You are a better judge about that company, so you may make a guess.
If you believe that an honest mistake was made then you should write them a letter telling them that you are not aware that you owe them any money, and to ask them why they believe that you owe them anything, so that any misunderstandings can be cleared up and fixed. Some records somewhere are likely incorrect and can be fixed. If you don't react, the person making the honest mistake will likely take further steps.
answered Jan 7 '16 at 10:42
gnasher729
70.9k31131222
70.9k31131222
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
suggest improvements |Â
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
5
5
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
I think there is a third possibility that an honest mistake was made when the debt wasn't removed from the final paycheque, and money is actually owed, jumping to the conclusion that someone is trying to stiff you up to bully you is quite egotistical.
– Kialandei
Jan 7 '16 at 11:41
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
As a taxpayer, most people want public agencies to handle money appropriately and as a result they are generally heavily audited. Failure to collect something like this in the final paycheck would often result in a bill later (sometimes years later) because of those audits or because of fear of those audits when it was realized a mistake was made. It is not the taxpayers problem that you spent the money and don't have it to pay back. I would be highly surprised if the law was not in the favor of the government agency collecting money they should never have legally paid out.
– HLGEM
Jan 8 '16 at 15:59
suggest improvements |Â
4
they're within the law in most countries to do so, you can serve a bill on anyone you like. Enforcing payment is a totally different matter. I would just ignore it, I wouldn't even reply. They're the ones responsible for making sure you don't leave overpaid, not you. I had a lawyer show up in person from an old employer when I started my business. No idea what it was about though, I didn't even bother reading it and never heard from them again..
– Kilisi
Jan 7 '16 at 10:14
10
Get legal advice. Don't base something that's very important to you on a random quote from the internet.
– nvoigt
Jan 7 '16 at 11:23
4
"What might help here?" Call a lawyer.
– Lilienthal♦
Jan 7 '16 at 11:44
1
@Frisbee, never underestimate the lengths and amount of money a government agency will go to to "save" money.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:12
2
Think about it the other way. What if you had unused leave that you had accrued but didn't use. Most public employees get to cash this out once they leave. If they forgot, wouldn't you want what was rightfully yours? Wouldn't you send them a letter or call them up and ask for your money? Dispute it and ask for proof that you used more leave than you had accrued. If they provide the proof, pay up.
– mikeazo
Jan 7 '16 at 13:15