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Boss spends the company's money and endangers employees' paychecks [closed]
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Somewhat related to this question.
A few months ago, a family member (it's not me, really) got a job at a small office with under 10 employees. The salary is low but not indignantly so, and she even got a small raise shortly after joining the company. However, the business owner is a wreck managing the company's finances. He leads an extravagant lifestyle, mixes his personal money with office money, and more than once the employees have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week. The latest incident was giving employees two days "off" because there was no money to pay them. The company has been in business for several years, so I don't know if these paycheck shenanigans are a recent thing or not.
I have repeatedly advised my family member to look for another job, but she insists on staying for a year or two because she is gaining experience in a new field and she feels some sense of loyalty due to an upcoming crunch time (and a lot of overtime pay). It took her some time to find this job so I can understand her reluctance to leave, but I can also see that this is not a healthy business. How can I articulate to her that she really should be looking for a different job? Barring that, what should she do in order to ensure an uninterrupted income while she stays at this company?
management salary
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
closed as off-topic by gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol Jan 21 '16 at 0:38
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol
 |Â
show 11 more comments
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
Somewhat related to this question.
A few months ago, a family member (it's not me, really) got a job at a small office with under 10 employees. The salary is low but not indignantly so, and she even got a small raise shortly after joining the company. However, the business owner is a wreck managing the company's finances. He leads an extravagant lifestyle, mixes his personal money with office money, and more than once the employees have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week. The latest incident was giving employees two days "off" because there was no money to pay them. The company has been in business for several years, so I don't know if these paycheck shenanigans are a recent thing or not.
I have repeatedly advised my family member to look for another job, but she insists on staying for a year or two because she is gaining experience in a new field and she feels some sense of loyalty due to an upcoming crunch time (and a lot of overtime pay). It took her some time to find this job so I can understand her reluctance to leave, but I can also see that this is not a healthy business. How can I articulate to her that she really should be looking for a different job? Barring that, what should she do in order to ensure an uninterrupted income while she stays at this company?
management salary
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
closed as off-topic by gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol Jan 21 '16 at 0:38
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
2
More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
2
@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
3
You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09
 |Â
show 11 more comments
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
Somewhat related to this question.
A few months ago, a family member (it's not me, really) got a job at a small office with under 10 employees. The salary is low but not indignantly so, and she even got a small raise shortly after joining the company. However, the business owner is a wreck managing the company's finances. He leads an extravagant lifestyle, mixes his personal money with office money, and more than once the employees have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week. The latest incident was giving employees two days "off" because there was no money to pay them. The company has been in business for several years, so I don't know if these paycheck shenanigans are a recent thing or not.
I have repeatedly advised my family member to look for another job, but she insists on staying for a year or two because she is gaining experience in a new field and she feels some sense of loyalty due to an upcoming crunch time (and a lot of overtime pay). It took her some time to find this job so I can understand her reluctance to leave, but I can also see that this is not a healthy business. How can I articulate to her that she really should be looking for a different job? Barring that, what should she do in order to ensure an uninterrupted income while she stays at this company?
management salary
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
Somewhat related to this question.
A few months ago, a family member (it's not me, really) got a job at a small office with under 10 employees. The salary is low but not indignantly so, and she even got a small raise shortly after joining the company. However, the business owner is a wreck managing the company's finances. He leads an extravagant lifestyle, mixes his personal money with office money, and more than once the employees have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week. The latest incident was giving employees two days "off" because there was no money to pay them. The company has been in business for several years, so I don't know if these paycheck shenanigans are a recent thing or not.
I have repeatedly advised my family member to look for another job, but she insists on staying for a year or two because she is gaining experience in a new field and she feels some sense of loyalty due to an upcoming crunch time (and a lot of overtime pay). It took her some time to find this job so I can understand her reluctance to leave, but I can also see that this is not a healthy business. How can I articulate to her that she really should be looking for a different job? Barring that, what should she do in order to ensure an uninterrupted income while she stays at this company?
management salary
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
asked Jan 19 '16 at 23:31
Pedro
68449
68449
closed as off-topic by gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol Jan 21 '16 at 0:38
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol
closed as off-topic by gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol Jan 21 '16 at 0:38
This question appears to be off-topic. The users who voted to close gave this specific reason:
- "Questions seeking advice on company-specific regulations, agreements, or policies should be directed to your manager or HR department. Questions that address only a specific company or position are of limited use to future visitors. Questions seeking legal advice should be directed to legal professionals. For more information, click here." – gnat, Dawny33, IDrinkandIKnowThings, Chris E, HorusKol
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
2
More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
2
@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
3
You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09
 |Â
show 11 more comments
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
2
More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
2
@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
3
You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
2
2
More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
2
2
@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
3
3
You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09
You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09
 |Â
show 11 more comments
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
up vote
11
down vote
Number one: You CANNOT ensure uninterrupted income. Understand that, and take appropriate precautions.
Your relative should bank 6 months' "subsistence level" expenses as soon as possible. There will come a day when she finds herself 4 weeks (or more) without being paid, and decides she's had enough.
Number two: This WILL happen. It's not if, it's when.
I worked for a company several years ago owned by a couple doing EXACTLY what you describe. I escaped about 10 months before it all imploded. Those that were still there did not fare well.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Juggling money is nothing new in small companies especially sole ownership ones, I do it myself, but I can always cover it from my other businesses if I have to, so no one has ever gone unpaid. It really comes down to who is juggling the money. Do they have other resources if things go South or are they living day to day. If your relative decides it's the latter then they need to start looking for another job.
The worst thing in your question is a couple of days off to avoid paying staff. That is a terrible sign that the boss is out of control even if he/she had a legitimate reason for being broke. It's also a sign of an unhealthy business that staff can take a couple of days off without business repercussions.
So in summary, unless the boss is wealthy in his own right or has other resources, this looks very bad for your relative and will probably all fall to bits one day. Best if your relative starts looking for another job now.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
2
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
0
down vote
A poorly managed company will also have limited growth. This also translates into further problems down the line - layoffs, lack of promotion, lack of raises.
There's no way to ensure uninterrupted income. Going bankrupt isn't exactly a crime, even if the boss is mismanaging. You can probably do something if they're forcing staff to work but not paying.
Surprisingly situations where a company hits near bankruptcy and then bounces to become a hundred-million dollar company are common. Even with owners who are not very bright. So your family member might actually be doing the right thing.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
suggest improvements |Â
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
11
down vote
Number one: You CANNOT ensure uninterrupted income. Understand that, and take appropriate precautions.
Your relative should bank 6 months' "subsistence level" expenses as soon as possible. There will come a day when she finds herself 4 weeks (or more) without being paid, and decides she's had enough.
Number two: This WILL happen. It's not if, it's when.
I worked for a company several years ago owned by a couple doing EXACTLY what you describe. I escaped about 10 months before it all imploded. Those that were still there did not fare well.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
11
down vote
Number one: You CANNOT ensure uninterrupted income. Understand that, and take appropriate precautions.
Your relative should bank 6 months' "subsistence level" expenses as soon as possible. There will come a day when she finds herself 4 weeks (or more) without being paid, and decides she's had enough.
Number two: This WILL happen. It's not if, it's when.
I worked for a company several years ago owned by a couple doing EXACTLY what you describe. I escaped about 10 months before it all imploded. Those that were still there did not fare well.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
11
down vote
up vote
11
down vote
Number one: You CANNOT ensure uninterrupted income. Understand that, and take appropriate precautions.
Your relative should bank 6 months' "subsistence level" expenses as soon as possible. There will come a day when she finds herself 4 weeks (or more) without being paid, and decides she's had enough.
Number two: This WILL happen. It's not if, it's when.
I worked for a company several years ago owned by a couple doing EXACTLY what you describe. I escaped about 10 months before it all imploded. Those that were still there did not fare well.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
Number one: You CANNOT ensure uninterrupted income. Understand that, and take appropriate precautions.
Your relative should bank 6 months' "subsistence level" expenses as soon as possible. There will come a day when she finds herself 4 weeks (or more) without being paid, and decides she's had enough.
Number two: This WILL happen. It's not if, it's when.
I worked for a company several years ago owned by a couple doing EXACTLY what you describe. I escaped about 10 months before it all imploded. Those that were still there did not fare well.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
answered Jan 20 '16 at 0:48
Wesley Long
44.7k15100159
44.7k15100159
suggest improvements |Â
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Juggling money is nothing new in small companies especially sole ownership ones, I do it myself, but I can always cover it from my other businesses if I have to, so no one has ever gone unpaid. It really comes down to who is juggling the money. Do they have other resources if things go South or are they living day to day. If your relative decides it's the latter then they need to start looking for another job.
The worst thing in your question is a couple of days off to avoid paying staff. That is a terrible sign that the boss is out of control even if he/she had a legitimate reason for being broke. It's also a sign of an unhealthy business that staff can take a couple of days off without business repercussions.
So in summary, unless the boss is wealthy in his own right or has other resources, this looks very bad for your relative and will probably all fall to bits one day. Best if your relative starts looking for another job now.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
2
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
0
down vote
Juggling money is nothing new in small companies especially sole ownership ones, I do it myself, but I can always cover it from my other businesses if I have to, so no one has ever gone unpaid. It really comes down to who is juggling the money. Do they have other resources if things go South or are they living day to day. If your relative decides it's the latter then they need to start looking for another job.
The worst thing in your question is a couple of days off to avoid paying staff. That is a terrible sign that the boss is out of control even if he/she had a legitimate reason for being broke. It's also a sign of an unhealthy business that staff can take a couple of days off without business repercussions.
So in summary, unless the boss is wealthy in his own right or has other resources, this looks very bad for your relative and will probably all fall to bits one day. Best if your relative starts looking for another job now.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
2
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Juggling money is nothing new in small companies especially sole ownership ones, I do it myself, but I can always cover it from my other businesses if I have to, so no one has ever gone unpaid. It really comes down to who is juggling the money. Do they have other resources if things go South or are they living day to day. If your relative decides it's the latter then they need to start looking for another job.
The worst thing in your question is a couple of days off to avoid paying staff. That is a terrible sign that the boss is out of control even if he/she had a legitimate reason for being broke. It's also a sign of an unhealthy business that staff can take a couple of days off without business repercussions.
So in summary, unless the boss is wealthy in his own right or has other resources, this looks very bad for your relative and will probably all fall to bits one day. Best if your relative starts looking for another job now.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
Juggling money is nothing new in small companies especially sole ownership ones, I do it myself, but I can always cover it from my other businesses if I have to, so no one has ever gone unpaid. It really comes down to who is juggling the money. Do they have other resources if things go South or are they living day to day. If your relative decides it's the latter then they need to start looking for another job.
The worst thing in your question is a couple of days off to avoid paying staff. That is a terrible sign that the boss is out of control even if he/she had a legitimate reason for being broke. It's also a sign of an unhealthy business that staff can take a couple of days off without business repercussions.
So in summary, unless the boss is wealthy in his own right or has other resources, this looks very bad for your relative and will probably all fall to bits one day. Best if your relative starts looking for another job now.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
answered Jan 20 '16 at 7:36
Kilisi
94.7k50216376
94.7k50216376
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
2
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
 |Â
show 1 more comment
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
2
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
1
1
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
Actually, in the UK you are only allowed to touch your own company's money either if the company gives you a loan (which is then an asset to the company, available to creditors in the case of bankruptcy) or as a dividend payment, and paying an amount of dividends that leave the company unable to pay its bills is illegal and can be criminal.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 9:07
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
@gnasher729 Are you saying it doesn't happen in the UK? Sole owners never put their hand in the till without documenting it and entering it into their accounting package?
– Kilisi
Jan 20 '16 at 9:50
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@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
@gnasher Does this apply to every company form you can have in the UK? In most countries I am familiar with this applies to various forms of limited-liability companies, but usually not to sole proprietorships where the companies money is the owners money and they can do with it however they please.
– Philipp
Jan 20 '16 at 9:53
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
In the UK, the company and the single shareholder are separate entities. The single shareholder owns the company, but can't just access the company's money. It wouldn't make sense to have the protection of a limited liability company while being able to extract unlimited amounts of money.
– gnasher729
Jan 20 '16 at 22:07
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
@gnasher not necessarily. I will provide you example. Boss buys car company but uses it for personal vacation, speeding. Police notifies the car owner (company) and demands fine. Boss authorizes payment with company money as the driver identity was unknown. Perfectly legal in my country, so next time you see a luxury car driving far overspeed on your left think about me :)
– usr-local-ΕΨΗΕΛΩÎÂ
May 31 '17 at 17:51
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A poorly managed company will also have limited growth. This also translates into further problems down the line - layoffs, lack of promotion, lack of raises.
There's no way to ensure uninterrupted income. Going bankrupt isn't exactly a crime, even if the boss is mismanaging. You can probably do something if they're forcing staff to work but not paying.
Surprisingly situations where a company hits near bankruptcy and then bounces to become a hundred-million dollar company are common. Even with owners who are not very bright. So your family member might actually be doing the right thing.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
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up vote
0
down vote
A poorly managed company will also have limited growth. This also translates into further problems down the line - layoffs, lack of promotion, lack of raises.
There's no way to ensure uninterrupted income. Going bankrupt isn't exactly a crime, even if the boss is mismanaging. You can probably do something if they're forcing staff to work but not paying.
Surprisingly situations where a company hits near bankruptcy and then bounces to become a hundred-million dollar company are common. Even with owners who are not very bright. So your family member might actually be doing the right thing.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
suggest improvements |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
A poorly managed company will also have limited growth. This also translates into further problems down the line - layoffs, lack of promotion, lack of raises.
There's no way to ensure uninterrupted income. Going bankrupt isn't exactly a crime, even if the boss is mismanaging. You can probably do something if they're forcing staff to work but not paying.
Surprisingly situations where a company hits near bankruptcy and then bounces to become a hundred-million dollar company are common. Even with owners who are not very bright. So your family member might actually be doing the right thing.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
A poorly managed company will also have limited growth. This also translates into further problems down the line - layoffs, lack of promotion, lack of raises.
There's no way to ensure uninterrupted income. Going bankrupt isn't exactly a crime, even if the boss is mismanaging. You can probably do something if they're forcing staff to work but not paying.
Surprisingly situations where a company hits near bankruptcy and then bounces to become a hundred-million dollar company are common. Even with owners who are not very bright. So your family member might actually be doing the right thing.
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
answered Jan 20 '16 at 8:51
Muz
752312
752312
suggest improvements |Â
suggest improvements |Â
Is she getting the overtime pay?
– user42272
Jan 19 '16 at 23:47
Has she ever not been paid or had her pay delayed?
– Jane S♦
Jan 19 '16 at 23:55
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More bluntly, my point is I don't see how you go from "have been left wondering whether they would get paid on time that week" to "I completely believe I will be paid all the hours of OT I log."
– user42272
Jan 20 '16 at 0:32
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@Pedro Depending on how the company was organized (LLC, partnership, sole proprietorship, Etc) using company funds would be within the 'right' of the sole owner. As he or she would be withdrawing equity from the company AFAIK. Financially speaking, yeah I agree. Owner is reckless and your family member should look for new employment.
– Frank FYC
Jan 20 '16 at 0:33
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You have given her your advice, she has taken it on board and made a decision to carry on where she is. I think it's time to respsect her decision and let it drop.
– Laconic Droid
Jan 20 '16 at 1:09