Mixing
relationship between I2C drawn energy / power consumption and data rate
Clash Royale CLAN TAG#URR8PPP
up vote
1
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Referring to just what the I2C lines draw, am I wrong thinking that the higher the clock frequency the shorter the time there will be (the same amount of) current flowing through the pullups and thus lower power consumed?
side qeustion
I don't think I am going to reach 100 kHz, that's way over the limit of my hardware. I am alternating between about 32 and 4 kHz. Will the same resistor value (3.3k @ 3V) be good for both ?
i2c frequency energy power-consumption clock-speed
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
Referring to just what the I2C lines draw, am I wrong thinking that the higher the clock frequency the shorter the time there will be (the same amount of) current flowing through the pullups and thus lower power consumed?
side qeustion
I don't think I am going to reach 100 kHz, that's way over the limit of my hardware. I am alternating between about 32 and 4 kHz. Will the same resistor value (3.3k @ 3V) be good for both ?
i2c frequency energy power-consumption clock-speed
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
Referring to just what the I2C lines draw, am I wrong thinking that the higher the clock frequency the shorter the time there will be (the same amount of) current flowing through the pullups and thus lower power consumed?
side qeustion
I don't think I am going to reach 100 kHz, that's way over the limit of my hardware. I am alternating between about 32 and 4 kHz. Will the same resistor value (3.3k @ 3V) be good for both ?
i2c frequency energy power-consumption clock-speed
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
Referring to just what the I2C lines draw, am I wrong thinking that the higher the clock frequency the shorter the time there will be (the same amount of) current flowing through the pullups and thus lower power consumed?
side qeustion
I don't think I am going to reach 100 kHz, that's way over the limit of my hardware. I am alternating between about 32 and 4 kHz. Will the same resistor value (3.3k @ 3V) be good for both ?
i2c frequency energy power-consumption clock-speed
i2c frequency energy power-consumption clock-speed
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
edited 31 mins ago
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
asked 1 hour ago
kellogs
29817
29817
add a comment |
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
Your thinking is correct, as long as you can achieve a higher speed with the same pull up resistors.
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
The I2C data and clock lines draw power when they get pulled low. Because then power is sunk through the pull-up resistors.
While a line is pulled low it will draw 5V/4.7k$~Omega approx$ 1mA. Assuming 5V VCC and 4.7k pullup resistors.
The clock line will have a 50% duty cycle. The data line is low at least 1 out of every 9 clock cycles (every ack for a successful byte) but you are rarely going to send/receive only 0xff bytes. It's more likely going to be pulled low 75% of the time.
But indeed faster clock means shorter transmission which means less power lost through the pull-ups. However faster transmission may require lower value resistors to overcome the parasitic capacitance between the lines and ground.
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
Higher clock frequency usually require lower pull-up value, thus increasing the current.
Increasing the clock frequency from 100kHz to 400kHz usually requires the pull-up to be reduced with a factor of 4-5.
Since the power is inverse proportional to the resistance the power consumed will be almost the same.
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
As @ratchet-freak stated, In terms of time, you could have 75% of the time the bus pulled-down, hence, if you increase the clock rate, your consumption by the bus will decrease as long as you have the same value for pull-up resistors. But, at higher speeds, resistor values should be reduced.
Having this, the consumption of the bus will be lower, but slaves and masters devices could increase their consumption depending on the clock rate.
Regarding your side question, if 3.3kohms suits both 4khz and 32khz, you have to check the capacitance of your bus. This capacitance depends on the length of the bus, the distance between lines and the number of devices attached to it. It could be difficult to calculate the real capacitance, but you can check the waveform of your data in the bus at both frequencies and see if there is any distortion of the signal at 32khz using 3.3k.
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
Your thinking is correct, as long as you can achieve a higher speed with the same pull up resistors.
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
Your thinking is correct, as long as you can achieve a higher speed with the same pull up resistors.
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
Your thinking is correct, as long as you can achieve a higher speed with the same pull up resistors.
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
Your thinking is correct, as long as you can achieve a higher speed with the same pull up resistors.
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
answered 48 mins ago
Arsenal
12k11240
12k11240
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
add a comment |
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
1
1
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
@kellogs cannot answer that as I have no idea what your lines capacitance is. So I can only tell you that we are running 100 kHz with 100 kOhm resistors in one of our products with no problems. I would guess that you are fine.
– Arsenal
21 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
any way to guesstimate it ?
– kellogs
14 mins ago
1
1
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
@kellogs well, 10 pF for any pin connected to the bus, 50 pF per meter for the length of the line would be a conservative guess I think. If your I²C bus is on a single PCB I have a hard time to imagine why it wouldn't work with 3k3 pull up resistors.
– Arsenal
9 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
The I2C data and clock lines draw power when they get pulled low. Because then power is sunk through the pull-up resistors.
While a line is pulled low it will draw 5V/4.7k$~Omega approx$ 1mA. Assuming 5V VCC and 4.7k pullup resistors.
The clock line will have a 50% duty cycle. The data line is low at least 1 out of every 9 clock cycles (every ack for a successful byte) but you are rarely going to send/receive only 0xff bytes. It's more likely going to be pulled low 75% of the time.
But indeed faster clock means shorter transmission which means less power lost through the pull-ups. However faster transmission may require lower value resistors to overcome the parasitic capacitance between the lines and ground.
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
The I2C data and clock lines draw power when they get pulled low. Because then power is sunk through the pull-up resistors.
While a line is pulled low it will draw 5V/4.7k$~Omega approx$ 1mA. Assuming 5V VCC and 4.7k pullup resistors.
The clock line will have a 50% duty cycle. The data line is low at least 1 out of every 9 clock cycles (every ack for a successful byte) but you are rarely going to send/receive only 0xff bytes. It's more likely going to be pulled low 75% of the time.
But indeed faster clock means shorter transmission which means less power lost through the pull-ups. However faster transmission may require lower value resistors to overcome the parasitic capacitance between the lines and ground.
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
The I2C data and clock lines draw power when they get pulled low. Because then power is sunk through the pull-up resistors.
While a line is pulled low it will draw 5V/4.7k$~Omega approx$ 1mA. Assuming 5V VCC and 4.7k pullup resistors.
The clock line will have a 50% duty cycle. The data line is low at least 1 out of every 9 clock cycles (every ack for a successful byte) but you are rarely going to send/receive only 0xff bytes. It's more likely going to be pulled low 75% of the time.
But indeed faster clock means shorter transmission which means less power lost through the pull-ups. However faster transmission may require lower value resistors to overcome the parasitic capacitance between the lines and ground.
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
The I2C data and clock lines draw power when they get pulled low. Because then power is sunk through the pull-up resistors.
While a line is pulled low it will draw 5V/4.7k$~Omega approx$ 1mA. Assuming 5V VCC and 4.7k pullup resistors.
The clock line will have a 50% duty cycle. The data line is low at least 1 out of every 9 clock cycles (every ack for a successful byte) but you are rarely going to send/receive only 0xff bytes. It's more likely going to be pulled low 75% of the time.
But indeed faster clock means shorter transmission which means less power lost through the pull-ups. However faster transmission may require lower value resistors to overcome the parasitic capacitance between the lines and ground.
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
answered 47 mins ago
ratchet freak
2,5001011
2,5001011
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
add a comment |
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
It also takes energy to charge and discharge the parasitic capacitance. I think another factor that affects power consumption is active time percentage of the bus.
– Long Pham
42 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
The power drawn charging and discharging the capacitance would (assuming you do not change the circuit and that your clock is slow enough for this happen to effective completion) be determined by the number of clock cycles but not by the clock rate.
– Chris Stratton
11 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
Higher clock frequency usually require lower pull-up value, thus increasing the current.
Increasing the clock frequency from 100kHz to 400kHz usually requires the pull-up to be reduced with a factor of 4-5.
Since the power is inverse proportional to the resistance the power consumed will be almost the same.
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
Higher clock frequency usually require lower pull-up value, thus increasing the current.
Increasing the clock frequency from 100kHz to 400kHz usually requires the pull-up to be reduced with a factor of 4-5.
Since the power is inverse proportional to the resistance the power consumed will be almost the same.
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
Higher clock frequency usually require lower pull-up value, thus increasing the current.
Increasing the clock frequency from 100kHz to 400kHz usually requires the pull-up to be reduced with a factor of 4-5.
Since the power is inverse proportional to the resistance the power consumed will be almost the same.
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
Higher clock frequency usually require lower pull-up value, thus increasing the current.
Increasing the clock frequency from 100kHz to 400kHz usually requires the pull-up to be reduced with a factor of 4-5.
Since the power is inverse proportional to the resistance the power consumed will be almost the same.
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
answered 35 mins ago
Peter Karlsen
44128
44128
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
As @ratchet-freak stated, In terms of time, you could have 75% of the time the bus pulled-down, hence, if you increase the clock rate, your consumption by the bus will decrease as long as you have the same value for pull-up resistors. But, at higher speeds, resistor values should be reduced.
Having this, the consumption of the bus will be lower, but slaves and masters devices could increase their consumption depending on the clock rate.
Regarding your side question, if 3.3kohms suits both 4khz and 32khz, you have to check the capacitance of your bus. This capacitance depends on the length of the bus, the distance between lines and the number of devices attached to it. It could be difficult to calculate the real capacitance, but you can check the waveform of your data in the bus at both frequencies and see if there is any distortion of the signal at 32khz using 3.3k.
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
As @ratchet-freak stated, In terms of time, you could have 75% of the time the bus pulled-down, hence, if you increase the clock rate, your consumption by the bus will decrease as long as you have the same value for pull-up resistors. But, at higher speeds, resistor values should be reduced.
Having this, the consumption of the bus will be lower, but slaves and masters devices could increase their consumption depending on the clock rate.
Regarding your side question, if 3.3kohms suits both 4khz and 32khz, you have to check the capacitance of your bus. This capacitance depends on the length of the bus, the distance between lines and the number of devices attached to it. It could be difficult to calculate the real capacitance, but you can check the waveform of your data in the bus at both frequencies and see if there is any distortion of the signal at 32khz using 3.3k.
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
As @ratchet-freak stated, In terms of time, you could have 75% of the time the bus pulled-down, hence, if you increase the clock rate, your consumption by the bus will decrease as long as you have the same value for pull-up resistors. But, at higher speeds, resistor values should be reduced.
Having this, the consumption of the bus will be lower, but slaves and masters devices could increase their consumption depending on the clock rate.
Regarding your side question, if 3.3kohms suits both 4khz and 32khz, you have to check the capacitance of your bus. This capacitance depends on the length of the bus, the distance between lines and the number of devices attached to it. It could be difficult to calculate the real capacitance, but you can check the waveform of your data in the bus at both frequencies and see if there is any distortion of the signal at 32khz using 3.3k.
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
As @ratchet-freak stated, In terms of time, you could have 75% of the time the bus pulled-down, hence, if you increase the clock rate, your consumption by the bus will decrease as long as you have the same value for pull-up resistors. But, at higher speeds, resistor values should be reduced.
Having this, the consumption of the bus will be lower, but slaves and masters devices could increase their consumption depending on the clock rate.
Regarding your side question, if 3.3kohms suits both 4khz and 32khz, you have to check the capacitance of your bus. This capacitance depends on the length of the bus, the distance between lines and the number of devices attached to it. It could be difficult to calculate the real capacitance, but you can check the waveform of your data in the bus at both frequencies and see if there is any distortion of the signal at 32khz using 3.3k.
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
edited 21 mins ago
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
answered 38 mins ago
gustavovelascoh
1756
1756
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
How about my side question ?
– kellogs
30 mins ago
add a comment |
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